Originally Posted by CK

I am sorry you feel that way.

Do not forget that staff is part of the community too. We were all affected equally.

Not really. I was able to turn my last feathers in on the 22nd. It's time zone related and unless every single staff member is from the USA then I doubt it affected all of you and looking at the entire Mene userbase it did indeed NOT affect everyone equally. It didn't affect me at all, so that statement is null and naught.

I agree with what Nemui said and I bow down to her for being so open about it. I have not been affected by this but I've taken the time to read through the responses and have gotten the same feeling Nemui has.

The community was screwed over at large, yes it was a misshap no one can be held accountable for, but damage control would be the proffessional thing to do here. Let people exchange their last feathers for event items for a grace period as long as the server was down on the 22nd.

I'm sorry if this sounds harsh, I'm not intending it to be. Just please realise that when a mistake happens then it needs to be fixed. It shouldn't happen at the expense of Mene user's because many will leave if it happens again if they do not already have. I imagine it to be endlessly frustrating having spent the entire event collecting feathers and then you don't get to spend them because of a server crash and when it's posted in a forum staff gives a "Oh well" attitude.

I'm sorry you feel that we have an "oh well" attitude, it's not that way in the slightest. As has already been explained, there was nothing we could do apart from say that we could do nothing.

Access to the site's code is something that only Inso has for a reason. The rest of us are not coders, the site's security is paramount, no-one has access to areas where a slight mishap could lead to major catastrophy.

We're not "not trying to give back" we, as AAs, physically cannot, and we are not going to start making promises to people to try and placate them, that we cannot keep.

I don't think the users in general realise just how much of a busy guy Inso is, just how much his day job demands from him, and how very little free time he's had recently. He does a sterling job for us none-the-less, despite being pulled in all directions by his "proper" job, he just hasn't had any time to do anything about this situation. I'm not even sure what he could do. Something would probably have to be specifically coded for people to be able to redeem their feathers, and depending on the amount of people who actually had enough remaining to be able to redeem them it might not even be worth it. I've seen very few people actively complaining about this.

I think saying the community has been "screwed over at large" is a gross exaggeration, and it's pretty hurtful to be honest. There hasn't been anything else that we could do about this situation.

On a side note, take it as a very nice lesson not to leave collecting and redeeming of extra currency to the last minuet. For future events. *bringing in humorous humors.*
:)

I've done it before, and paid for my lesson by going to the exchange for my items.

People leave it to the last minute every time. Events end at 6pm CST, we tell them this when the event starts, it's up in the event FAQs the entire time, and they still leave things and end up not being able to redeem all their currency (then complain). It's just how some people are ._.

what if in the future, the exchange for event items could be extended one day past the event?

Then if people miss it, they can't complain about it. An extra 24 hours is very generous.
As to coding for it, simply set a timer on the function that awards the event currency, like normal. Simply set a seperate timer on the exchange shop and set it for a day later?

I don't think so. Give an inch, people take a mile, you know? Event items stop being given out once the event ends, that's pretty cut and dried. You start murkying the waters by doing things like you're suggesting and we'd never hear the end of it.

What about people who missed the 24 hour extension too, do we then have to make it 36 hours, or 2 days, or a week? Do you see the issue?

I do see the issue, and I see where you are coming from.

At the same time however, I do see the problem of when the event store closes.
Not to mention that 6 o'clock is such a weird time. For many people in several timezones, they miss out on a whole day of the event due to school, clubs, responsibilities, etc.

Why 6 and not midnight? or atleast ~10pm.

there are many more active users around after six. It seems counterproductive to end it so early in the day

There is one point about event item which is different from Event commons is that, they are released one by one, instead like commons, which is already there since the beginning.

I exchange at the last day to see how to optimize my currency if the price for each event item is not the same. So I can have as many sets as possible without currency being wasted because of not enough currency to exchange expensive item.

Trystan~ Time zone is a confusing thing. DX
Every hour, there is a timezone that is at midnight. How to know whether which time would be majority people's online time?

That wouldn't work because of timezones either, for me the events already end at midnight, if they ended at midnight central that would be 6am for anyone in my timezone.

No matter what time the event ends somebody somewhere is going to miss out at some point.

The events used to end at noon central. People largely complained that they wouldn't be able to use anything of that last day of the event, so it was changed to six pm central. Events usually end on Sundays, so that lets people in the US, at least, get home from church and get changed and finish homework before they get online again (assuming they go to church on Sundays). Sometimes, yes, due to a holiday falling at an odd time during the week, we do have to end an event during the week, rather than on a Sunday. Those people who had things to do during the day during the last day of an event are advised to rid themselves of their extra currency before they log off and if they have any extra time, they can try to get extras.

You honestly cannot make everyone happy. We do our best. We honestly, really, really do.

I'm always depressed after events for several days because I read the feedback and feel like I have failed you guys by not giving you what you wanted from the event. Even though the entire event I was incredibly happy because everywhere I turned, I mostly saw people saying they were enjoying themselves and it was their favorite event and so forth - when it comes to event feedback, I always always feel like I've failed because I want to make everyone happy.

I know I can't do that. I cannot possibly make all (insert number of individual users here) members of Menewsha happy with events. It is impossible. Because while some people liked that, say, Valentine's '09 wasn't cute hearts and flowers and lace and cupids.... The other half was disappointed that it wasn't.

I am very sad that the site died for twelve hours and some people missed out. Those were twelve hours I would have had available to me to get extra sets as I'm on more of a nocturnal schedule (my hours are closer to those Australians live on, in fact). So, yes, I did miss out just the same as other people missed out.

But I cannot turn back time and fix things that broke during the event.

It wasn't possible at the time to extend the event. We would have if it had been within our control, but it wasn't. And it's not as simple as saying, "Well, next time, don't code it that way!" because who knows how simple a fix that is?

There is no reasonable way that I can think of to have people redeem feathers after the fact if they forgot to do it before they logged off or weren't able to before the site died and they were asleep when the event ended. Every way I can think of takes unnecessarily complicated coding which would take days and be used by only a few people - OR - has the AAs working their fingers to the bone doing something needlessly tedious when we could be working on the next event or next feature.

It's not that we don't care.

It's that no possible method could be come up with that is worth the trouble. It would be like building a bridge over a gutter. We're sorry about people's shoes. But ours are getting wet too.

Please at least try to see it from our perspective.

As far as the time zone thing goes, why don't we try to find one that works for a majority of Menewsha? Anyway you do it, it'll be different for everyone in different time zones, but if we can get it to fit the majority of the population, it would be really helpful.

Originally Posted by jellysundae

People leave it to the last minute every time. Events end at 6pm CST, we tell them this when the event starts, it's up in the event FAQs the entire time, and they still leave things and end up not being able to redeem all their currency (then complain). It's just how some people are ._.

True, but in this case, the FAQ was kind of confusing... The announcement and the FAQ both had different dates this event, and the correct date was on the announcement. ^^;
In relation to what xuvrette has said, it's not until the day-before-last that all the event items are out. We don't have a choice but to wait last minute to exchange for EIs because it's not released until then. Then we have only have a day left to get feathers for the last EI. >>;
However, we don't know just how many feathers we need to get all of the items we want; we'd have to wait for the last item to be revealed before having the information we need to budget out our feathers, you know?
Not trying to argue or anything; just trying to defend us last-minute redeemers. ^^;;

Originally Posted by jellysundae

I don't think so. Give an inch, people take a mile, you know? Event items stop being given out once the event ends, that's pretty cut and dried. You start murkying the waters by doing things like you're suggesting and we'd never hear the end of it.

What about people who missed the 24 hour extension too, do we then have to make it 36 hours, or 2 days, or a week? Do you see the issue?

I like Trystan's idea because essentially, the event is over, but if you missed it due to RL affairs, you don't have to let all your feathers go to waste.
Maybe you can note that the line draws there? For example, when we tried alternative currency for event commons, people liked the idea; when you took it away, well, there weren't really any complaints. It was made known that it was already a privilage offered when we used the currency, in addition to the event commons being half off.
With the extra time to exchange feathers idea, maybe we can give it a try?
We'll realize that it's not necessary, it'll be appreciated, I think. Instead of a full 24-hours, it could just be until the rest of the weekend. As CK stated, most events ended on Sunday evening. The event can end on Sunday evening, but the EI exchange wouldn't have to go down until midnight or something. If it doesn't work out, then we don't need to do it again. I mean, isn't most of it trial and error anyway? ^^;

Originally Posted by CK

The events used to end at noon central. People largely complained that they wouldn't be able to use anything of that last day of the event, so it was changed to six pm central. Events usually end on Sundays, so that lets people in the US, at least, get home from church and get changed and finish homework before they get online again (assuming they go to church on Sundays). Sometimes, yes, due to a holiday falling at an odd time during the week, we do have to end an event during the week, rather than on a Sunday. Those people who had things to do during the day during the last day of an event are advised to rid themselves of their extra currency before they log off and if they have any extra time, they can try to get extras.

And that's appreciated - it really is. It's just that in the case, with the server crash, we couldn't redeem them before Sunday - and it's not like we have the time to check back every hour to see when Menewsha is back up again and exchange the ASAP. ^^;

You honestly cannot make everyone happy. We do our best. We honestly, really, really do.

I'm always depressed after events for several days because I read the feedback and feel like I have failed you guys by not giving you what you wanted from the event. Even though the entire event I was incredibly happy because everywhere I turned, I mostly saw people saying they were enjoying themselves and it was their favorite event and so forth - when it comes to event feedback, I always always feel like I've failed because I want to make everyone happy.

I know I can't do that. I cannot possibly make all (insert number of individual users here) members of Menewsha happy with events. It is impossible. Because while some people liked that, say, Valentine's '09 wasn't cute hearts and flowers and lace and cupids.... The other half was disappointed that it wasn't.

Don't feel bad! DD:
Don't get me wrong - just because there are complaints, it does not mean the event wasn't enjoyed! Personally, I really enjoyed it. It's just that if all we ever do is praise, nothing could be improved... ^^;;
No matter what you do, there is pretty much always going to be a negative reaction, and a majority of the time, it can't be prevented. I mean, appeal to the masses and the minority frowns upon it. You just can't appeal to everyone. For the most part, though, I feel you guys are doing a really good job.
You guys are appreciated, and the positives of the events really outweigh the negative. -hug- D:
There's no way to please everyone, but just do your best like you guys have done in the past, because you're doing a great job, really. ^^;




Overall, I realize that what happened had happened, and it would be unwise to toil over it forever. I mean, initially, this was just a question on whether or not there would be compensation, and how it would've been dealt with. ^^; It was a question, and I didn't know that the event couldn't be extended because it wasn't under your power to begin with, or that nothing could be done. I just wanted it to be recognized that I hoped there could be something to make up for it, and that I hoped it wouldn't happen again in the future; I'm not demanding there to be an overwrite of the system or anything. >>;
I'm sure the staff is working very hard on how to prevent issues during the events, along with their other responsibilities around the site. Some things can't be helped, and we realize that. It doesn't mean you're hated because the server crashed, or that the event couldn't be extended - both of which are out of your jurisdiction. It's not the staff's fault, and I don't mean to blame you.
I'm glad the problem's be recognized, but I'm not trying to start an argument or anything. ^^;

edit;
homg long post
x___x;;

The reason I am butting in is because, the feather counter is still there. So as I am not a coder, I do not know how code works to relate, but I thought the feather counter is associate with the whole event. If the feather counter is taken away the same time, I doubt people would complain much? (well, because they can't see how many feathers they wasted.) Naturally, since the feather counter is there, it just somehow plant an impression that we can still redeem the remaining feathers.

I am not blaming the coders or admins or staffs, I appreciate all the efforts done for the event. It is an accident no one is to be blame on.
As I now understand only Inso can get access to the main code part, and he is busy, so I do not press on the event extension. Just to explain the reason why some people do last day redeem. I redeem my items around a day before, but in the middle of redeeming, the server crash came. To be exact, I am not really doing last minute or last hour redeem, more like last day? to wait for the last item to release as well. (I never mention extend event for buying event commons. *winks*)

It would just be nice to just show our point of views in this particular accident.
I was really disappointed when the event is not extended, because previously, some event extended(if I am not mistaken.), so I thought this time would be the same, as the server crash is more than few hours. But now, I see how the code works, thanks for explaining, admins, so I feel a bit better, or at least clearer to what happened.

I do not mean to be demanding or harsh(as I have stay up late night just to wait for the server to come back in case if there is no extension, and redeem everything.), just thought to point it out, in case the same thing happen in the future where I won't be able to stay up late like this time.

Cheers, thanks staff and I apologize for my harshness.

We were able to extend events before, because Ken coded an on/off switch in, basically, but that was really just so we had a means to shut an event down instead of him having to be online to do it. Inso improved on the method by coding the event to end automatically, and that is an improvement when nothing's gone wrong, but has caused issues this time around. I have requested if we can have a manual over-ride added so that if an event does need extending we can do so and prevent unpleasantness like this happening again.

It's all trial and error you know? Finding ways to tame the technology and get it to work for you instead of against you. Because right now, I'm thoroughly convinced that the server Inso bought was:

a) made from recycled washing machines, as it eat a lot of people's clothes, socks in particular.
b) is possessed : /

Is there a possible way to set up a thread in a way similar to the staff store? IE People have so many feathers they trade with the staff NPC to get the event items equal to their feather amount left?

*Shrugs* I personally was able to get everything i could before the stuff went poof, and i feel bad for those that missed out. But well...s**t happens ya know? Give the staff a break. They ARE people too. AND they DO NOT get paid to do this.

No, because there's no way to trade the feathers, and anyway, they've gone now.

Someone still would have had to manually trade the items anyway - see also: A solution that would take more work (coding as well as time-spent) than it's really worth in the end. :/

Originally Posted by jellysundae

It's all trial and error you know? Finding ways to tame the technology and get it to work for you instead of against you. Because right now, I'm thoroughly convinced that the server Inso bought was:

a) made from recycled washing machines, as it eat a lot of people's clothes, socks in particular.
b) is possessed : /

-giggles-

Well now I just have a question; what are you guys planning to do if this happens again in the future?

I doubt that it will. Because once things like this happen, we know to do something to prevent it in the future.

I am going to lock this thread since there isnt going to be an extension. Any suggestions or feedback on the matter can be addressed in the Event Feedback Thread