WRONG. Wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong.

I started with alcohol. I stopped with alcohol. I don't smoke tobacco or marijuana or anything else. I've never done any other drugs. I've never been hospitalized for intoxication. I've never been drunk more than twice a week (and even that's rare for me).

My dad hates tobacco, rarely drinks, and openly admits that he used to smoke pot. He's never done a harder drug. EVER.

My mother (before she met my dad) did coke. ONCE. And never again. She did it because of her pot dealer.

There's no such thing as a "gateway" drug.

The gateway is the drug dealer. The dealer will push other drugs onto his customers in an effort to make more money. The harder the drug, the more money he makes.

If a marijuana dealer has no other drugs to offer his buyers, then it's likely those buyers will never do any other illegal drugs.

People are gateways. Social pressures are gateways. Not drugs. Drugs don't "make" you do other drugs. People will try though.

I don't have any problems with the rest of your assertions, but you can't place blame on drugs for things they don't do.

Yes, yes it does.
There is nothing at all to suggest tobacco leads to alcohol, alcohol to marijuana, marijuana to whatever else, and so on. Your point is based on a falsehood so yeah, it means it's invalid.

Also, just to clear everything up, the gateway drug theory is not based on anything chemical or physical, such as a need to get a better high, but rather that someone who uses one drug will, because they are around other, stronger drugs, begin using them as well. This theory has no evidence for it except in the case of illegal drugs, such as pot. It's true that many people who start off smoking pot do begin using other drugs, however, this is because their dealers are often selling other drugs and will often try to get them into those other drugs to make more money. Make pot legal, and able to be sold in drugstores or whathaveyou, and the "gateway" effect goes away entirely, at least for pot.

I have a friend who is in bad places since she met boyfriend and she like drugs and their parents tell her out of her homehttp://imagecache2.allposters.com/images/WIZ/2204.jpg

So her parents are essentially kicking her out because of a lifestyle choice and drugs are the problem here? Your mind works in odd ways. :|

A ha! But it does! If my self control keeps me "off of other drugs," then a lack of self control will result in someone else doing them. This is completely independent of the drugs themselves.

You just contradicted your own argument :)

Marijuana: Opinions, Please
 

Points I feel need to be made, simply because.

1. There are NO confirmed deaths caused by the use of marijuana alone.
Only deaths caused by injuries sustained in an intoxicated state.

2. There are no extra added chemicals in marijuana, if you take it directly from the plant.

3. Marijuana does not kill brain cells. It places them in a hibernated state for a relatively short period of time, however they do not simply die.

4. THC in itself is not addictive.
Marijuana can be psychologically addictive (because it's something that makes you feel good), however withdrawal symptoms from THC are typically caused by a user with an 'addictive personality', and are very far from life threatening.

5. Marijuana was made illegal because, one, it challenged the paper company, and two, because of a man named Harry J. Anslinger, the director of the Bureau of Narcotics, appointed in 1930.
Anslinger realized that opiates and cocaine would not be enough to help build the agency, so he began making outrageous claims about marijuana, such as "Marijuana is an addictive drug which produces in it's users insanity, criminality, and death."
and
"Marijuana is the most violence-causing drug in the history of mankind."
This was also a period of time where it was perfectly fine to publish racial slurs, but I will exclude those, and post the link for those who wish to read more.
Why is Marijuana Illegal? - Drug WarRant

6. Hemp can be used for a good sized list of products.
I'll post a link to an image here now, simply to save time in typing out every use.
http://www.torontohemp.com/hempuses.jpg
Please take a look at that image before making any claims that marijuana cannot be used for purposes other than recreation or medical.

7. Marijuana is proven to be an extremely helpful pain reliever in many, many cases.

Alright, those are the primary points I wanted to make.
My sources include:
Erowid Cannabis (Marijuana) Vault
Drug WarRant

Along with lots and lots and lots of personal research, including various websites that I have stumbled upon in my time online.

I am not saying that everything about marijuana is good. It increases the heart rate, and can cause mild to severe anxiety attacks, and a good list of other ill symptoms that can happen, but that are frequently the same with a majority of commonly used prescription medications. There are cases of allergic reactions to marijuana, though they are much fewer than most other cases of allergies. I will also say that it CAN cause some lung and throat problems if you SMOKE it, as any kind of smoke can and will cause lung/throat problems.

There are already two threads about marijuana, but I believe the debate on legalization would be a more appropriate place to put this. I'm going to merge these two threads together.
http://www.menewsha.com/forum/commun...marijuana.html

The only problem I have with that is that the last post here was made in November of last year. I was looking for a topic that would perhaps get some activity and a couple of new opinions. But I'm totally fine with it. I just need to fix my post so it doesn't sound like the opening of a new topic anymore.

A new thread should only be started if there isn't a topic about it already. :yes: Posting and bringing up a thread should be enough to get new discussion started if there is something more to discuss. :D

Most ... well, ALL of the potheads I know are extremely lame. I'd hate for there to be more people like them in this world, and there would be if this stuff was legalized.

I disagree with you. I think marijuana IS a gateway drug in the sense that kids try it and are like ,"O HAY, PEOPLE ALWAYS SAY HOW BAD 4 U THIS IZ, BUT IT REALLY ISN'T. I BET ALL DRUGZ R LIEK THIS!"


But when it all comes down to it, I guess I am pretty neutral. I don't really care. I just think that it would lead to a lot more idiots , because as I've stated, all the potheads I know are really lame. I understand some people smoke it for other reasons, but a lot of people do it because they think it makes em "TOTALLEE KEWL".

I wouldn't smoke pot either way because it smells horrible. I don't see how some people LOVE the smell. It's one of the most disgusting smells ever. That's the main thing keeping me from trying it , that and the fact that I have better things to do than drugs. Like being lazy.

Just like how Prohibition got rid of alcoholism and violence caused by or relating to alcohol.

(Pro tip: It didn't.)

Honestly, how many people do you know who actually think this way? I have a very hard time believing this is the norm. Also, by your logic, wouldn't the problem lie with people spreading misinformation about pot, and not pot itself? After all, if there weren't so many people lying about it being deadly or extremely damaging or life-ruining, that someone's life remains fairly intact after trying it wouldn't be a shock, and they'd have no reason to associate it with other drugs.

Also, you're right, marijuana is a gateway drug -- because it's illegal, and for no other reason. If it were legal, potheads would get their supply from pharmacies, or grow their own, rather than buying from someone who, more often than not, is selling other drugs at the same time. The temptation (and nudging of the dealer) to try his other products does not exist if the dealer doesn't.

I'd venture to say MOST people smoke it for "other reasons". Like, you know, they enjoy it. Or those who smoke it for religious/spiritual reasons. Or the ones who smoke it to relieve pain or increase appetite. Granted, some may first try it because it's considered "cool", but as marijuana is not physically addictive, that has absolutely no bearing on why they continue it.

Phil, I probably would've gone into a raging tirade after all the points I made previously, but you did a much better job than I would have at explaining a lot of things that I wouldn't be able to explain out of frustration, and I completely agree with you.

wow, nice. I couldn't put it in any better way.

Well I was going off of what I know. I'd like to believe that most people smoke it for other reasons, but I really don't think that's the case. In the area I'm from, everyone does it because it's "cool". If it's not that , they do it because they have nothing better to do and the only way they can have is by being high or drunk or whatever. A lot of people I know ARE addicted to the feeling of being high, not pot itself obviously, but just the idea of being high.

One of my best friends got into pot, and it really messed with her life. She doesn't do it anymore , but looks back on those days and gets disgusted with herself. She completely changed as a person then. I know that this isn't everyone's case, but again, most of the stories I've heard involve something similar. People don't really lie about that sort of stuff.

I really don't care about this topic. I guess it wouldn't affect me much either way. I just wanted to reply because I felt like getting my ideas across.

lol! it should be legalized! it really should! in fact I beleive that it is less dangerous than caffine.
you can die from caffine overdose, not once have I ever heard of someone dying from marijuana over dose.
and really some of the smartest people I know smoke the stuff. they say that it helps them ease their heads after a long stessfull day of craming for a test, or the mental havoc that comes with info overload headaches. and hemp is one of the stongest, most durable material I know of (that can be hand made.)

I really hope that they legalize it one day, so the people in kentucky can stop growing it next to the moonshine.
(no offence to the natives of kentucky!)

To add to it, it actually started with Mexicans coming over to work and smoking it at the end of the day. The white racists (Specifically in El Paso I believe) decided to ban it.

You can actually find a lot out about it by watching a movie named "Grass" Woody Harrelson narrates it, and it's pretty informative. Also supports legalization. It's on Netflix as a watch instantly for those who are curious. Also, "Super High Me" which is also on Netflix watch now area, is somewhat informative, more of a punch in the face to the Supersize Me guy though, but it's worth the watch.

Thinking along that vein, I think one could overdose on anything if they had an astronomical amount of it ;)

MARIJUANA: Legalize or Not?
 

If anyone has been keeping up with the legislature "Democrat Assemblyman Tom Ammiano reintroduced legislation on Thursday that seeks to legalize the production, distribution, and personal use of marijuana for adults age 21 and older" (NORML). Of course if this happens, there will be an increase in marijuana usage? I do not think so. Here is why. Just because you CAN drink at 21 doesn't mean that you will. When I turned 18 and could by cigarettes, I didn't. Because, I didn't smoke. So what? It's a RIGHT to have, and with that right it can also be abused.

Now--what do people say? "Well then they will drive," of course they will drive. But--what about this? If you ask stoners "What are some ways to catch someone being high, if pulled over, and we'll legalize marijuana." I'm sure that there would be billions of suggestions as to how.

Ryokushin, I merged your thread with the already existing Marijuana discussion in the debates forum.

No, legalizing it does not stop people from abusing it. No one has said it does. Legalizing does keep people who aren't hurting anyone but themselves out of prison, thus helping with overcrowding, and would serve as a new source of tax revenue. But making it illegal doesn't keep people from abusing it, either. Instead, it allows for shady business dealings, it makes people willing to die and kill to grow, smuggle, and sell it because making something illegal decreases the supply while keeping the demand the same, thus raising the price and the lengths people are willing to go to make money off it, and it allows for absolutely no sort of quality control. In short, your mentality is responsible for drug wars, human trafficking, and countless deaths, all because you think pot is stupid and therefore do not care what happens to the people involved with it.

And for your information, "stupid people doing drugs" is NOT why we have drug laws. Almost every drug law currently on the books came about because of politics or greed or racism. Cocaine, for instance, was considered a cure-all and far from illegal...until people noticed that it was largely the African American community using it. Americans were big fans of opium until it became associated with the hated Asian immigrants to the US and they decided to outlaw it. Likewise, marijuana was only criminalized because hemp could be used for just about everything and because it was so much cheaper and easier to grow than just about any other suitable plant, the paper industry lobbied to have it made illegal to grow, and launched a smear campaign to make sure it was associated with mental illness and uncontrollable behaviour. The result? People like you who believe it's the devil and a still-existing demand for hemp that can only legally be met by importing it from China or other countries that didn't succumb so easily to the propaganda, since we can't grow it here. Way to go.


I really like that you used the example of people not doing what you say as proof it's addicting. Ever stop to consider that maybe, just maybe they didn't quit because they didn't want to quit, and not because they couldn't? I am told the high from pot is enjoyable, so why would they stop just because you want them to? Facts are facts, and the fact is, the chemicals in marijuana do not mimic any chemicals produced by our own bodies, which is how physical addiction happens. You can get mentally addicted to it, certainly, but you can get mentally addicted to absolutely anything. It all depends on the person in question, and if the person in question has become mentally addicted to pot, they also likely are mentally addicted to a number of things you likely have no problem with in and of themselves, like TV or the computer or chocolate or exercising or dieting or reading.

Let's think of a lot of other unhealthy things that we haven't made illegal. Caffeine or fried foods or even excess sugar, for instance. I personally think eating meat or eggs or drinking milk, with the already lax and fairly unenforced food safety laws we have in this country, is a stupid thing to do, yet even me just saying that gets me compared to Hitler and even accused of treason, let alone if I suggested we outlaw them. But am I not thinking of public safety? Am I not policing people for the sake of preventing them from doing something unhealthy, something I see as "stupid"? The fact is, we are allowed to do what we want with our bodies, and it's a damned good thing. We can pierce ourselves, tattoo ourselves, scar ourselves, eat the most unhealthy, disgusting junk we can find. We can even consume things we know will almost certainly kill us eventually, and not only is it entirely legal, but when we eventually have a heart attack or a severe allergic reaction or develop cancer, the hospital can't go, "Well, you're a dumbass, so we're not wasting our time on you". We are treated the same as people who suffered things completely beyond their control, at no fault of their own. That is the right we have to our bodies, the right to do what we please with our bodies as long as we aren't hurting anyone else. By and large, the only time non-pot smokers are adversely affected by pot, it stems from problems that would completely disappear were it legal. True, there are many laws besides the anti-marijuana laws that violate our rights to our own bodies, but every law like this that is done away with is a step in the right direction. And really, what is more important: forcing our personal moral codes and sensibilities on everyone else so that you're as comfortable with their personal lives as you are with yours, or cutting down on violence and crime and providing a safe environment for people to do what they would be doing regardless of whether or not it was illegal, only with more danger to their wellbeing than could possibly come from inhaling plant smoke?