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I have conflicting views about some of the finer details, but I do believe it should be legal and that women should have the choice.
Now, yes, there will be women who are totally capable of raising a child who will have an abortion. But think about that. If that woman doesn't want the child that much, and is that selfish, does she deserve to be a mother? Isn't that the kind of mother who you would see and think "She doesn't deserve that child"? Wouldn't you feel bad for the kid for having such a poor quality of childhood because his/her mother DIDN'T WANT IT? Sure, you may think "but that's better than the kid being killed." But that's subject to debate on whether the fetus is truly sentient and conscious at that time or not. Early in pregnancy, I don't think it is. I think it's alive in the same way that a plant is alive. Only, obviously, it WILL become sentient and conscious later on in its development, while a plant, of course, never will. The later into the pregnancy you get, the more murky I am on it. I would have to do more research onto how and when the brain forms in utero to make an opinion on when the fetus is totally alive. |
@evil Kitten...read further down, the you won't hate me so much, or maybe you will...and yes it is a person when it hits...just becuase scientists are all "scientifical" isn't my fault...
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Using that logic, do you distinguish between an omelet and a chicken dinner?
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OMG, have I been eating liquid chickens all this time?! D':!
I prefer fetuses being eliminated before their brains develop and start functioning than children being abused, or having parents that do not know how to raise them. These children will become society's cancer one day. And when that happens, nobody will want to acknowledge that it could have been different. PS: The law says that a person is a person when he/she is born and has a birth act document. Or at least that's what the laws in my country say... somebody do some research on that please? D: |
As far as I know, at the moment you are not a person in the US until you're born.
But I haven't actually researched. |
@everyone above this post, but mostly Kinmotsu: I dunno, I don't really like eggs or chicken...or steak...or hamburgers...and I don't eat pork...I do however like sushi and salmon roe...together...so why bother distinguishing? My baby will be my baby when it's conceived, so I might as well view everyone else's that way....I'm not trying to change your opinion, just stating my own...*does a little dance and looks off spacey-like*
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Such as the recent murder case in California. I'm forgetting the names. But the wife was 8 months pregnant when her husband killed her and the convicted him on 2 counts of murder. But I think it varies at how far along one is too. Because at 8 months the kid could of survived outside of the womb. |
Well, it's more a matter of personal opinion here but I think once a child could survive outside the womb it's more on the person side and less on the fetus side. At that point, it's pretty much developed. But overall the mother still has rights, because it's still her parasite.
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I'm openly pro-choice about abortion. =3 I hope I don't anger anybody by saying this, but, quite frankly, I wouldn't oppose a law/executive decision (in the U.S.) that would prohibit all teens under 18 from having kids. Mind you, I wouldn't ever actively pursue making something like that a reality, but if someone passed me a petition for it, I'd not hesitate to sign. Again, I hope no one gets offended by that, as it was not my intention. I will admit that the above was not always my opinion on the matter, though. As recently as January 2007, I was very much of the opinion that "it's only okay under certain circumstances," such as you (the OP) are. However, some very nice ladies were kind enough to school me in the matters of female empowerment/equality. I know that if I were able to get pregnant and did not wish to be, I would want the choice to abort. I'm not in a place in my life that having kids would be a good idea, nor would I be willing to put another child into our already-horrible adoption system. So, abortion would have been my choice if it were possible for me to be so. :3 While I am pro-choice on the matter, I -do- wish some people would stop using it as an alternative to contraceptive. I know that condoms/birth control/diaphrams can be bothersome and/or take away from the physical pleasure, but getting "scraped" every time you have a bun in the oven isn't worth it. :\ |
I firmly believe that abortion is murder.
.. I am also firmly pro-choice. When you have an abortion, you are killing someone. I will not deny it in an effort to justify my being pro-choice, so I can think "oh it's not really a person..!" It doesn't matter whether it's a nearly fully-formed child or a little blobby slimeball, you are denying a person their right to life, by killing them before they have a chance. However. I also believe that, by infringing on your physical body without your full consent, that person has already legally forfeited that right. Someone who is invading your body through rape you can harm without being worried about getting in trouble for it, so why not someone who is invading your body, sapping your energy, causing you physical and emotional pain, etc.? Of course, that's all sort of legalese: you can't actually expect a fetus, embryo, whatever you want to call it, to have the ability NOT to do the above. It's not just going to hop out and bugger off if you tell it you're displeased. And I don't have an answer for that. But I think it's better to get rid of it when you can than to have it brought into a world where it will be unwanted and neglected. |
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I don't like it when people say "you're denying them the most marvelous gift of god/nature!". In my opinion, the growth of a mango tree is much better. They don't take any living creature life away, and are productive for the rest of species. I have yet to see a human protecting the right of mango seeds to be put into good soil and asure them a healthy growth until they are trees :shock: It would be really funny :insane: I support the thought that it's better for fetuses to dissappear before they become neglected children. Because these neglected children will be part of an unhappy next generation. PS: Life's like chili: Whatever you do today, can burn you ass tomorrow. Ouch. :gonk: |
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this is ridiculous. when the sperm hits the ovum, it's known as a zygote. if the zygote implants, it becomes an embryo, and if the pregnancy doesn't end in miscarriage, the embryo becomes a fetus and then once the fetus is born, it then becomes a baby or infant. the ovum doesn't MAGICALLY become a baby once the sperm penetrates. |
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Until after a few months, the child cannot feel anything. It's better to abort it in that stage and let it go without suffering than to have the child be born and killed right after birth because abortion is not allowed. And it happens. Just today it was on the news: a newborn baby, no more than a few days old, was found in some apartment block's storage room. It was in a bucket, wrapped in a few blankets, dead. And there's no sign of the mother. I could be wrong, but I think that if she got the chance to abort, she would've done it and she would have spared the child of dying when it was conscious and able to feel pain. |
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A non-person does not have the right to life, as we've so thoroughly proven with the meat industry. |
Tell me this, Fabby. Would you be willing to eat an aborted unborn?
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If you paid me enough. xD
But I wouldn't willingly eat the fetus of anything. A slimy little ball of cells doesn't sound appetizing no matter what species it's from. In addition, most species don't do the whole cannibalism thing unless driven to the extreme. It's like anti-breeding, and we are pretty much here to proliferate. |
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Only a non-person that isn't in danger of extintion doesn't have the right to live :P But since we're talking about humans... and we're the most abundant mammal species on Earth... I guess we don't have the right to live :'( PS: Is Red Calypso vegan? o.ô |
That is SO not a fetus. It's an EMBRYO, which make a nice substitute for salad dressing.
...Okay, I'll stop. We wouldn't be so damn abundant if we'd stop getting in the way of natural processes. >_>;; |
... wait what?
The last line. You mean we'ra already being cloned, or that we're more fertile than normal because of a medical way? o.Ô PS: So chickens never go through the fetus stage... hmm interesting~ |
No, no. It's just that the things that naturally keep a population in check keep getting stopped in their tracks by humans. Other animals are all subject to disease. >_>;;
I actually know nothing about chicken development, to be honest. xDD |
xD
Oh, you mean that diseases are kind of a living-control, cause we always find ways to live longer instead of dying? Hmm~ To an extent, yes... but most people don't have enough money to treat fatal diseases xP At least not in my country, which is a third-world one ^^' Leaving chickens aside, and going back to abortions, I think sexual education should be enforced and more wide-spread. A survey was made to the teenagers of my country, being the main question "What do you think about the sexual education program?". a girl answered: "Well, I, as a catholic christian, think that such a thing shouldn't be taught. It's something my husband and I should learn by ourselves, with all the love we have to each other." Another said: "I don't have any problem with it. We all will learn it from the internet anyways." ... which means most girls in my country don't have any idea what "sexual education" is xP They way they answered evinced that they thought they would be taught w/e was written in the Kama Sutra, instead of the development of a baby, body processes, hormones, consequences of pregnancy, moral, etc. *rolls eyes* The surveyers should have explained in order to make them give an answer related to the question xP Now even more people are missinformed about what "sexual education" is >.> I hate ignorants :( PS: Going back to chickens, I'll try to look for it on wikipedia. Though I'm not sure of sucess since it's 3:55 in the morning and tomo- today, I've got to clean a couple of rooms. Talking about hardships XD |
I know it's a horrible thing to say, but an epidemic would do the world good. If we continue to overpopulate at the rate we're going, the world is just going to run out of resources and life as we know it will pretty much be over. But this is kind of a separate debate... I've been derailing threads a lot lately. I need to stop before it becomes a habit.
Yes, I definitely agree that sex education needs to be much, much better. This whole abstinence only thing is BULLSHIT. Complete and utter bullshit. A lot of girls believe the silly rumors they hear, like you can't get pregnant if you have sex in a pool, or if you're on your period, or if the girl's on top, etc. Hell, I even believed the sex on your period = no pregnancy one for quite some time because it kind of made a lot of sense. xD But the reason why they believe these isn't because they're stupid, it's because no one has bothered to teach them better. If we had real sex ed that gave the facts and debunked these rumors, I'm pretty damn positive that the abortion rates in teens will go down at least a little. |
I agree with most of what the OP said.
What I don't agree with: A 12-year-old having an abortion. Yes, they're not old enough to take care of themselves or another life. That being said, they shouldn't be having sex. If you're not old enough to accept the consequences, don't get yourself in that predicament. All these young teenagers are having sex, not realizing how big of a deal it is. They aren't going to learn if they're just allowed to abort the baby and go back to doing what they had been doing. Abortion is not murder. Have you studied it or seen pictures? Fetuses develop nerves early on. I don't remember the specifics. I've been out of school for over three years now. However, I do remember that it's a cruel, painful process that is equivalent to murder, even if the fetus is still forming and not outside the mother yet. However, I do think abortion should be legal. If it were illegal, people would still do it, and then, it would be dangerous and life-threatening for those like a raped woman who should be allowed to make that decision. (Just think of an abortion procedure like Penny in Dirty Dancing.) |
First to Never Know... are you honestly advocating a 12 year old having a CHILD? They're a child themselves! They certainly are too young to be having sex, but forcing them to have the baby is the worst option for all. I have my doubts that the girl would even be developed enough to give birth... she'd probably have to have a C-section. I find it horribly, terribly wrong from a moral standpoint to force a CHILD directly into adulthood because they made a mistake.
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That's a concept I've never understood, but so many pro-lifers always take.
How is it acceptable to teach a girl a lesson by ruining both of their lives, not to mention the consequences on the family at large. |
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