I think abortion is far too much of a personal thing to be considered by our legal system. I like the idea of it being a case by case option. Abortion should be legal, but the woman should know everything she is risking and all the consequences of her decisions. She should hear opinions of the people around her, but the final decision should be hers, and the option should be there.

I am for pro life and I think that even if someone got raped and has a baby, they can put it up for adoption. There are many people out there how would love to have a child to call there own. People that have sex and make mistakes when they are 12-18, should either put it up for adoption or keep it because it's their fault and their choice for what they did and people need to pay the consequences.

I love making children punishments. There's nothing better than telling a teenage girl or women that what should be a joy is now a burden. Yes, let's put more children in situtations where they will be unloved, neglected and abused, because they were mommy and daddy's mistake andthat's why they drink and do not love them enough.

Also, there is quite a few children right now, wanting to be adopt, but they are not ever going to be because they are not white, healthy babies, where the adopter's know the mother. So let's crowd and already crowded system with more children.

Also, Abortion is a consquence to an action. It's taking responibilty more than forcing unwanted children upon someone who does not want them or putting them in the system for life.

1) That is an extremely callous way to look at it, you realize?

--Adoption's a solution to PARENTING, not PREGNANCY. And there are a LOT of side effects to pregnancy that are not pleasant and that you couldn't PAY me to go through.

--Abortions are cheaper than births.

--All this withstanding, you'd let a raped woman bear nine months of shame and psychological torture for something that isn't even sentient at the point where most abortions take place? Lovely.

2) They can go adopt the minority, older and special needs children the system has left to fester and rot. If children are wanted, why are there so many people looking to adopt? Oh, right, they want the healthy white newborn. God forbid a white couple adopt a black kid, or a kid with Down's, or a 10-year-old kid.

My body is not their personal baby machine.

3) Abortion IS a consequence of pregnancy. A consequence is merely one possible outcome of an action. Abortion is a possible outcome of pregnancy. Therefore, abortion is a possible consequence of getting pregnant.

The problem here is that you are giving "consequence" a negative connotation and punishing the evil teen for having sex. Yeah, it's illegal, yeah, they shouldn't be doing it. News flash: They're going to do it anyway. Leave the option for them to continue their education and "child" life open.

I believe that if there is nothing wrong no action should be taken. Live up to it. You had sexs and that is what happens if you do. Now if there is something wrong then I believe it is for the best to stop the birth. Not just because opps I had un protected sex and I'm going to have a kid. I feel that is wrong on your part. Also I see the same way all for but the 12 year old. She did it and shouldn't get off. Now if it was messing with her body to the point that yes its a big problem thats another story.

1) Define "wrong."

2) There are also other reasons for having sex, you know. Pair bonding, social activity, pleasure. Sex is no longer all about procreation, you realize.

Also..."Live up to it?" WHAT? I hear this line parroted by lifers all the time. If life is so precious, then why shove it on an unwanting mother? What good does that do for either of them? Are you under some sort of impression that it will suddenly cause maternal wuv and caring at first sight? That doesn't explain why there are so many dumpster babies and abused children.

3) a. Sex is not just for procreation, and it should not have to be so. I, for one, am childfree. I do not want kids, I do not need kids, and I am not callous enough to give any baby up for adoption. One way or another, the fetus is leaving my body in the unlikely event I conceive.

b. Not all couples want children, at least not at that point. They have sex because it encourages pleasure, intimacy, pair bonding and socialization between the two of them. Sex is no longer about procreation, and families no longer have to involve children.

c. Look. People are going to have sex anyway, no matter what optimism you try to put into it. EDUCATE THEM. Make BC more easily accessible. Protest abstinence-only education. Make sterilizations for people like me more of a choice. Teach kids that they can use all of these methods in tandem to help prevent pregnancy.

4)Again, define "wrong." What makes an ectopic pregnancy fetus different from a regular fetus? What makes a rape fetus different from a fetus conceived by consensual sex?

Also? Over half of the abortions in the US are done by adult females in committed relationships when birth control failed them. Chew on that a bit.

5) Are you trying to insinuate that a 12-year-old can successfully carry a child to term without their being any effects on either her or the baby's health? Ready to birth does not equal SHOULD.

6) Again, show me the difference between these two.

For example--I am a bipolar self-injurer who has previously had suicidal thoughts. My hormones are out of whack enough without some spawn of me and another man adding to it. It might, in fact, send someone like me over the edge--after all, that's a rather massive influx of hormones to an already unstable system....

Now what have you to say to that?

Who said that they wanted a kid? Things happen. Just because a person is told about birth control ect things happen. Birth control is only 99.9 % affective its never 100%. You are the one risking it failing. I say to the last part. If the person is having that much trouble why is the person adding to it buy geting into that position?

touchy subject..... its hard.. I dont agree on it but I believe theres a time and place..

if your raped and get prego.. yes you should be able to have the abortion.. cause in all honesty you'd never love that child...

a 12 year old shouldn't have sex... and I think if a 12 year old gets prego she needs to HAVE the baby and let her mother and HER take care of it.. cause thats the parents fault for allowing such to happen... >.> shit I didn't know what sex was at 12!

Unless its life threatening have it...

if you wouldnt use protection you deserve to have your life ruined...

Not saying children are bad just saying your life is destroyed cause you have a main priority.. ::shrugs::

Well that is my opinion....

I don't know...
I don't think it's right if you are going to abort (kill) a baby just because you dont want to full with it, it's your fault for not being careful so deal with it and if you don't or cant take car of them then find a caring home for them...or take pills before you have sex? xD Idk...
BUT I can understand if you want to abort if something bad happened to you and it would only bring back memories...like if you were raped or something..
I'm kind weak on the subject though..soo...yea...>_>

I agree with your opinion.

And that makes it more right and more justified in forcing it on other individuals why...?

This is the Debate forum, not the Sharing Opinions forum. It's fine if that's your opinion, but you better come prepared to back it up. I'm not letting you off that easy.

Why?

C'mon kids. If abortion is murder, then it isn't justified in the case of rape - two wrongs don't make a right. And if it isn't, why then is it so bad to have one because you made a mistake? I wish I didn't have to keep saying it, but it's a bit damned harsh on a kid to be born as a punishment for their parent being careless, rather than as a loved and wanted addition to the family.

Or put into the adoption system--especially as a minority, older or special needs child.

Or killed on birth and then thrown in the dumpster or trash can.

Indeed!

It's like the whole business in India and China, where a lot of foetusses are aborted because they're female. A girl child is seen as a bad thing since they'll be married off and won't bring the family any money, compared to a male child who's obliged to stick around and look after the parents in their old age.
Now, that's a sad state of affairs, and a reflection of what progress needs to be made on the status of women in those countries, but I'd say it's better that a female foetus is aborted, than for the alternative - huge incidences of female babies being abandoned or given up for adoption.
Telling prospective parents the sex of their baby is illegal in India at least, and abortions are available in both nations, but there's still far too many female babies who are born and then abandoned.

Of course, I'm heading off onto another issue here, but I hope it's a useful example.

Ooooh, I didn't know they did that in India, too. That's sad.

...It's good to know, though, that there are precautions being taken to help prevent female infanticide in other countries. Of course, it'll never be quite perfect. But better something than none.

There's a slow change about it.
Was reading where a doctor was about to throw a guy out of a hospital over in India for lighting of fireworks, till she discovered he was celebrating te birth of a Girl.

I at least know with China, with so few girls, they are getting the pick of the litter with Guys.

but it is sad. You have posters over there saying things like "500 rupes now, or 3500 later" pushing abortion because of the whole dowery thing. Though luckly a few places in India and around that area are actually working at getting rid of the dowry.

I think the option should be made available to everyone, especially in the early stages of pregnancy. Aborting a fetus when it hasn't developed enough to feel pain is better than leaving a baby in a dumpster, and that's what happens a good portion of the time when someone has a baby they didn't want. Sure, there are better options (I know California has a good Safe Surrender program), but a lot of women are too afraid to take advantage of this program as it stands. An ex-friend of mine went out and got pregnant, then left her baby in the dumpster. Luckily, they found it and managed to save it.

I think that "morning-after" pills should also be made easier to obtain, since the day after conception, the zygote is completely incapable of feeling any kind of pain. It has no brain as of yet. It is, in the strongest sense of any period in the pregnancy, still a part of the mother's body.

I DO think that people should put more focus on alternatives. I know for a fact that if I ever became pregnant with a baby I didn't want, I'd just deal with it and hand it over to the Safe Surrender program when it was born. Of course...not everyone feels the same way.

So, while abortion wouldn't be the option I'd EVER choose...I wouldn't deny the choice to anyone. Let them know exactly what their doing (for instance, inform them of the approximate age from which the fetus can perceive pain), and let them make a decision based on their OWN moral standpoint. The area seems to be a 50% shade of gray, so what else can you really do?

Ah yes, the debate over whether the morning-after pill can be considered an abortifacient.
I do find that one particularly interesting, seeing as it's extremely common for fertilised eggs to naturally fail to implant in the womb lining. If you go by the 'life starts at conception' belief, then there's millions of women who miscarry without even realising it.

Wow, im very surprised everyones taking a grown up view on this ^ ^
Now if you posted this somwhere els.. @ @ There would be a very differnt crowd ^ ^.
WAY TO GO Menewsha!
Anyways this topis in itself is a very risky topic.
But im fore peoples choice.

Why?

Cuss if we outlaw obatshon the babys with no homes well go up!
Ally way aborchins well happin again ( Its where a lady meets up with either a doc or even a friend with a coat hanger and does a self aboshion right there.. Many babys survive and become disformed after birth OR the mother simply dies from invetoin cuss she could be jailed in the first place in doing what she did)
And.. Does anybpdy rember anything from your first year of life? or even 2?
IN my own persinal opienyen ( I know many well disagree with me and call me heartless)
But a baby when its in you is a cancer!
Looking at it at a scientific view
Cancer is the over growth of cells feeding off of the body and making the person sick..

A baby.. is an over growth of cells taking energy away from the mother and making her sick..see the basic similers..

Anyways all in all its all up to the mother in what she wonts to do, no one els not her mom, husbend, brother, paster/priest/holy-man.
Cuss they dont havta go throw the pain, to metal stress, the sickness, and all that other fun stuff that come with having a baby.

If you have read this thank you ^ ^
Babys are cute thow ^ ^

Did you not read charis_mae's thing? Stupidity and selfishness are no reason to force someone to give birth!
Not to mention that teenagers who are absent-minded enough to forget to use protection - or to not use it even though they know there's a risk of pregnancy - are unlikely to make the greatest parents.

Also, regarding your response to disturbed's post, you really think it's better for a child to be abused than to be aborted? An aborted foetus never has a life, it's removed before it can think and feel - whereas a child who was abused by their parents has to live their entire life with that trauma. Think about it logically.

Might I just add my five cents and say that made no fucking sense whatsoever?

Not only did you fail to answer the question, you failed to address the issue PERIOD. This isn't about teens "getting protection." This isn't about them "being stupid teens." Which is untrue, in fact. Over HALF of the abortions in the US are made by married/committed couples who HAVE used birth control. So yeah, way to stereotype women who get abortions. As a childfree individual who is appalled at the state of contraceptive education and difficulty it takes to get a tubal litigation, this stereotype angers me. I am NOT a "stupid teen" and I certainly don't want to have sex "without protection" for the hell of it.

So next time you talk about teens who "just didn't want to use protection," how about thinking about just how little good education on contraception there is out there and how much abstinence-only education is pushed. Then ask yourself again why the world is so messed up.

....I....what....

This is made of so much fail I have no idea where to start. So again, I'll just address the fact that you used someone else's post to push your agenda, and in doing so completely twisting what it was saying.

Next I'll move onto your blatant disregard for the quality of life. Why is an abusive and neglected life better than no life at all? Why is starving, being beaten, or ignored most of the time better than being snuffed out before you're even aware of your existence?

And regarding your last point--I wouldn't even know I existed if I had been aborted. So why the hobgoblin frick should I get all teary-eyed and pussy-footed at the thought that I might not even be here right now if my mother hadn't been a Catholic woman and wanted me?

I suggest you do your research before posting here again, ma'am, because quite frankly your ignorance is astounding.