So I was having a chat over skype with a few friends that started with Jelly's topic about guns. But the conversation evolved, as conversations do, from the topic of guns to the topic of racism(not us being racist I assure you but rather a talk of the concept of racism), and eventually led into the topic of government and the idea of Utopia/ Dystopia.

I thought it would be interesting to get some more takes on the concept of Utopia/Dystopia.

For those who don't know what either one is here is a few definitions I have sniped off of Google:

Utopia: is a community or society possessing highly desirable or near perfect qualities. Utopia is considered a perfect society.

Dystopia: is a community or society that is in some important way undesirable or frightening. Dystopia is the complete opposite of utopia.

I will add my thoughts as time goes on but I thought I would hear some of your thoughts.

Also because I promised I would Iroase Delschatten:

---------- Post added 04-26-2014 at 07:59 PM ----------

I am not going to add spoon fed questions because we all know that will mean people come post the answers and leave. I wish to spark and actual conversation. So I guess I'll just start the discussion rolling by asking.

What do YOU think Utopia or adversely Dystopia is?

Utopia to me is like the world of Star Trek. Star Treks world is where humanity has reached the apex that where people exist just to work because they can and want to. They get everything for free and there's no means of currency in existence due to the evolution that was caused due to the Warp Drive. I think the utopia in the version of Star Trek would be the best result compared to others because it would allow humans to work together and not be limited by currencies that hold back many countries from getting the best quality stuff such as healthcare to living conditions. It'd be a fair world if the Trek reality came to be.

Dystopia to me would be more like Blade Runner. It's a typical dystopia in that it's dark and there's tons of poor. Not to mention crime is at an all time high. There's dumps everywhere and the condition of most places is beyond questionable. Corporations have alot of influence. Not to mention most funding comes from corporations anyway so they have a major influence on the world at hand. Another possible dystopia would be Idiocracy which is movie that deals with the deevolution of humanity to a point where education is corporate guided and they only know what the corporations tell them. Not to mention that the lowest common denominator of humanity is the ones in control of the world so therefore the gene pool has only people who contribute worse to the entire worlds gene pool. It's scary in both instances and the worst possible outcome.

Utopia to me is like the world of Star Trek. Star Treks world is where humanity has reached the apex that where people exist just to work because they can and want to. They get everything for free and there's no means of currency in existence due to the evolution that was caused due to the Warp Drive. I think the utopia in the version of Star Trek would be the best result compared to others because it would allow humans to work together and not be limited by currencies that hold back many countries from getting the best quality stuff such as healthcare to living conditions. It'd be a fair world if the Trek reality came to be.

Unfortunately I have never seen star trek, but I will comment on what you have put down here. People live to work because they want to. In its essentials but I am of the mind frame that humans by there nature are lazy and selfish. I do not think that they chose to be this way I think it is simply the way that there nature is. We as a human race have to work hard not to give in to these tendencies and as a rule we have done fairly well. In order for a society that you speak of to exist the human species must evolve so that it is no longer in our genes to be lazy or selfish. It would also require our genes to evolve to the point that we no longer can have the feelings of love, and joy. Our love and our joy would be work. The opposite gender would merely be used to breed with.

But then I too believe that utopia would be devoid of these things. So this may seem close. Human Emotion and Utopia cannot coexist can it?

Dystopia to me would be more like Blade Runner. It's a typical dystopia in that it's dark and there's tons of poor. Not to mention crime is at an all time high. There's dumps everywhere and the condition of most places is beyond questionable. Corporations have alot of influence. Not to mention most funding comes from corporations anyway so they have a major influence on the world at hand. Another possible dystopia would be Idiocracy which is movie that deals with the deevolution of humanity to a point where education is corporate guided and they only know what the corporations tell them. Not to mention that the lowest common denominator of humanity is the ones in control of the world so therefore the gene pool has only people who contribute worse to the entire worlds gene pool. It's scary in both instances and the worst possible outcome.

I agree that not only is this a Dystopia, but I feel as if it is the most realistic path for our future to take should it fall into Dystopia. Going back to my earlier thought that humans are very much selfish and lazy by nature, they would eventually want government/corporation to take over there lives while they in fact indulge in these instincts. But then there is the opposite side of this as well. There is another very inherent human trait that would need to have evolved out for dystopia to exist, the need to survive. Humans (as well as any animal. Humans are nothing more then an evolved animal) have a very distinct survival gene.

I agree with Cora. People are lazy. People get lazier the more free stuff they get.

I find that I am happiest when I can enjoy the fruit of my hard work. Nothing worthwhile is easy, and that should be a challenge to build something better and greater than what was before, to become better men, and achieve higher satisfaction. Pain and labor are necessary to make good things, just ask any Mother.

There's my two bits.

Originally Posted by zotar

I agree with Cora. People are lazy. People get lazier the more free stuff they get.

I find that I am happiest when I can enjoy the fruit of my hard work. Nothing worthwhile is easy, and that should be a challenge to build something better and greater than what was before, to become better men, and achieve higher satisfaction. Pain and labor are necessary to make good things, just ask any Mother.

There's my two bits.

If only the whole of society viewed things as such. At a point when it was deemed by society that this was the accepted there were a lot more people that have this point of view. Yet, societal views change often and now this is no longer the accepted norm. We have slipped perhaps back into our lazy and selfish ways brought on by the ease of technology. I feel we are headed towards a state of dystopia.

Think for a moment. How many people wouldn't be able to survive if the internet completely went down?

HA!

Zotar has just encapsulated Menewsha's ethos in a paragraph there.

The ideal the hard work = better results but that the more free someone gets the lazier they end up?

yup, pretty much in a nut shell there