Originally Posted by fongmingyun

Perfect? :p Suffice to say, there are a lot of things you can't fix with a computer.

=/ I don't think either versions of art reach perfection.

Perfection, if it exists, is in the here and now. Though we try to capture beauty, try to capture perfection, try to capture human emotions at its most intense...I don't think anyone has reached that.

Originally Posted by ScarletStratholme

I disagree. There is a finite number of poses which the human body can be comfortably put into. I don't care if 50bajillion people use the same poses.

Humans tend to do some things the same way. When you are angry, you set your body a certain way. There is of course, deviation from that, but generally speaking, there are certain stances; otherwise animations wouldn't work to express things as well because we would not associate the characters' poses with this emotion or that.

We smile the same, we frown similar, we even show boredom in similar fashions.

Poses have little to do with default bodies.

Poser bodies where you just shove clothes on are far more equivalent to Barbie dolls where you just buy clothes and dress them up, and call that art, than anything else.

As a 3-D modeler, I have to agree with you. Poser isn't fully a media on its own... it's meant to be a reference. For me, it's much more like dolls.
But like, true modeling... is like a digital version of sculpting. Dear god, it requires patience. A sick amount of patience.

I don't mean if you change the models or the clothes, but if you just use preset models and given clothes and don't really change much about it other than put the clothes on the model. Then that isn't really much work or much art at all...because it took little to no effort, and ANYONE who has a finger to click with can replicate exactly what you did in a matter of minutes once given an instruction manual to read for about 10 minutes.

If you start changing the body, the skin, or the pose a TON, etc. and a lot of it is your own work, then I think yes, it is artwork and yes it is worth something.

The level of customization is what determines if it's a Barbie-doll type, or no longer a Barbie-doll to me. It's like if you were to buy premade color lay-over things for pre-made lineart...then it's not really YOUR work you know? But if you start changing the lines, changing the patterns, the colors, the tone and texture...then yeah, I guess it's fair to start selling it higher. But if someone made it all for you..not just that, but it's a really easy to make thing...like say you were selling "ball" pets, which were just spheres with different designs, and the designs you obtained through "brushes" that you got from the internet, and they were premade almost entirely...and all you did was type in plain text for the cert...then that's not a pet I'd spend even 1 Gaian gold on. I have the same feelings towards "art" of any type. If there was 0 effort and 0 thought put in, or close to 0..tisn't worth it.

Originally Posted by ScarletStratholme

I don't mean if you change the models or the clothes, but if you just use preset models and given clothes and don't really change much about it other than put the clothes on the model. Then that isn't really much work or much art at all...because it took little to no effort, and ANYONE who has a finger to click with can replicate exactly what you did in a matter of minutes once given an instruction manual to read for about 10 minutes.

If you start changing the body, the skin, or the pose a TON, etc. and a lot of it is your own work, then I think yes, it is artwork and yes it is worth something.

The level of customization is what determines if it's a Barbie-doll type, or no longer a Barbie-doll to me. It's like if you were to buy premade color lay-over things for pre-made lineart...then it's not really YOUR work you know? But if you start changing the lines, changing the patterns, the colors, the tone and texture...then yeah, I guess it's fair to start selling it higher. But if someone made it all for you..not just that, but it's a really easy to make thing...like say you were selling "ball" pets, which were just spheres with different designs, and the designs you obtained through "brushes" that you got from the internet, and they were premade almost entirely...and all you did was type in plain text for the cert...then that's not a pet I'd spend even 1 Gaian gold on. I have the same feelings towards "art" of any type. If there was 0 effort and 0 thought put in, or close to 0..tisn't worth it.

Yeah.. like, I wasn't disagreeing with you, but like... when people think that a pic done in poser takes as much time and effort as something from scratch.... it's kind of dissappointing - and scratch models usually don't look as good unless you're a professional, so people are like "why should I care?". I really admire the people who made the poser models but not so much the people who use them and then say it's core 3-D Art.

• For me. i do both types of art. I have to, I'm doing an art GCSE, although, it generally focuses on Traditional methods of art.
  
  I like to draw with my hands on a Piece of paper, get really annoyed at my rubber and the fact that my page looks like a mess, and eventually refine it and everything, I generally work harder on traditional work and enjoy it. I try harder on traditional work because it generally goes towards my grades, and I can work on it more or less anywhere. I also like the slightly, larger range, almost of things I can do, From Pastels and Characoal, to watercolours, oils or acrylics, it's sort of, there's something very different with each method, or the way it's done is different.
  
  I also like digital media as well though. Even though I find it is generally the same motion, even if it's a different brush. I like the undo button and the earaser on the computer, but I also hate the undo on my photoshop. No matter how many times I change how many times back it should be able to undo to, its always only one, and I find that annoying sometimes. I also find it tedious to work on the computer, staring at a computer screen becomes boring after a while, or at least, i think it does. I don't generally stare at one for more than half an hour at a time, and even during that time, i'm generally not at the computer that much. I like the different brushes and teh things that can be done with digital media, and the maybe slightly more professional look that can be given to things. but I also find that sometimes depending on what it is, the same thing can be done for both.
  
  I don't have a preference, but I like Traditional because I can take it anywhere with me, but digital sometimes because of the looks that I can achieve with it. I don't mind either form though to look at or to do my own are in ^^

Originally Posted by Lennifer

• For me. i do both types of art. I have to, I'm doing an art GCSE, although, it generally focuses on Traditional methods of art.
  
  I like to draw with my hands on a Piece of paper, get really annoyed at my rubber and the fact that my page looks like a mess, and eventually refine it and everything, I generally work harder on traditional work and enjoy it. I try harder on traditional work because it generally goes towards my grades, and I can work on it more or less anywhere. I also like the slightly, larger range, almost of things I can do, From Pastels and Characoal, to watercolours, oils or acrylics, it's sort of, there's something very different with each method, or the way it's done is different.
  
  I also like digital media as well though. Even though I find it is generally the same motion, even if it's a different brush. I like the undo button and the earaser on the computer, but I also hate the undo on my photoshop. No matter how many times I change how many times back it should be able to undo to, its always only one, and I find that annoying sometimes. I also find it tedious to work on the computer, staring at a computer screen becomes boring after a while, or at least, i think it does. I don't generally stare at one for more than half an hour at a time, and even during that time, i'm generally not at the computer that much. I like the different brushes and teh things that can be done with digital media, and the maybe slightly more professional look that can be given to things. but I also find that sometimes depending on what it is, the same thing can be done for both.
  
  I don't have a preference, but I like Traditional because I can take it anywhere with me, but digital sometimes because of the looks that I can achieve with it. I don't mind either form though to look at or to do my own are in ^^

What version of Photoshop are you using?

For anything past 7.0, you have to do control shift-Z to step back more than one step. Anything like, 5.0 or earlier doesn't have multiple undos.

I dunno la. Both have ups and downs you know? I'm just more familiar with a good ole paintbrush. :)

i use both!! and when i offer both, people usually go for traditional as well!!

hmmm i like traditionall artttt betterrr lol i think it requires actualtalent...

I use both...but is trying to improve my digital art skills xDD Both types of media requires practise to get a good finished piece...I myself don't really have a preference for any though ^^

I only do traditional, I don't have a tablet. xDDD;;