Thread Tools

Insomniac
Janitor
Administrator
Insomniac is offline
 
#1
Old 07-11-2010, 06:05 PM

Hey everyone, I'm going to do something I'd otherwise be against doing, and that is give everyone a thorough insight into avatar communities with a focus on menewsha and how things are going for us.

Expenses per month

I'm not going to state exactly what every individual gets paid (because you just don't do that), but here a grouped run-down:

Designer (full time) + Artist (part time) + AA's - $2,200
Pixel Artists (contract) - Ranging from $500 to $2,500
Flash Designer (full time#) + Coder (Full time) - $3,100
Server hosting - $600
Me (coding, managing, direction) - FREE

Total monthly expenses - $6,400 up to $8,400

Then we have advertising which can be anywhere from nothing to $2,000 per month, which means some times the site spends over $10,000 per month on expenses. We don't even hire our coder and flash designer from the US because we're forced to outsource to get the costs down.

Revenue per month

Now here is the revenue, note that there are zero costs removed from this apart from transaction processing fees:



This means that last month (because we are in-between coders) it COST me $4,614 to run this site. In other words, I go to work every day, work my ass off, get a pay check, then give a large chunk of my pay check to other people to keep this site running. I DO NOT claim menewsha against tax, I DO NOT take sponsored funding, and there IS NOT some huge corporation behind this site - just little ol' me supporting the difference between what the site makes and what it costs. But let me make this clear, I do not blame any of you for this, but I'll explain that further later. Yes, to put it in plain text, I lose over $50,000 per year running this site.

Children of Gaia

It is well known that Zantarni, Roliana and Kinsaki all have declining numbers of sales. There is proof of this in the numbers that were publicized from Roliana's sale. We also have reason to believe Solia is not doing too well based on post stalking, which means all of the second tier sites from Gaia are ALL having difficulties. The even smaller sites still may be doing okay with their minimal expenses, but the future is looking pretty bleak. You might ask why I refer to this as the children of Gaia - well lets face it, all of the sites I just mentioned were started by people who wanted their own little version of Gaia. Most of our users have had a Gaia account, and when a new user comes here most of the time they were make a parallel between the two. So lets not beat around the bush, we are spawns of Gaia, and we're failing, which means Gaia is more than likely suffering too, or is soon going to be.

Why are we failing?

Gaia was founded in 2003, at the height of a worldwide boom in anime. At the time they were heavily focused on anime hype and they created a pretty interesting situation where boys - who would otherwise think dress up was girly - started playing virtual dress up. This meant that unlike traditional dress up sites Gaia catered to males almost as much as females, and unsurprisingly, along with it's anime focus, became very, very popular. Gaia in it's growth made a lot of mistakes which upset a lot of it's users, which resulted a vast amount of the older users leaving. These users found homes in the children sites of Gaia, all of which vowed to never make the same mistakes. It's now 2010, a full seven years after Gaia's founding, and the Gaia deserters of the beginning are now mostly in their twenties, some with kids, married, or just generally not interested in the same things anymore. These people are what the child sites of Gaia rely on for donations to keep running, but they are growing up.

There are 82,927 members of this site right now, of which 1,605 have donated. This means for every one person we get contributing to the site, we have 51 people who never do. The ability for the site to continue to exist is quite literally resting on the donations of only a few - but those few are growing up and have other things they would prefer to spend their money on or do. We can't blame anyone for growing up, and I do not want to blame any of you who don't spend anything.

The problem here is that we are servicing a niche which doesn't carry the weight it used to. I'd put money on the fact Gaia users do not spend half the amount of months on the site as they used to because the niche they are serving no longer has the hype it used to. As you can see from here Google Trends: draw anime the amount of people interested in the creative side of anime has decreased from the days of Gaia's founding.

I could go on about different theories here, but the end facts are the same:

1) Sites spawned from Gaia are failing
2) People are donating less, and not just because of the economy
3) The niche we serve does not have the same hype is used to
4) If we do not evolve the niche we will die

Vexatious~Venom
(。⌒∇⌒)&...
Banned
812.80
Vexatious~Venom is offline
 
#2
Old 07-11-2010, 06:12 PM

Jeez, I didn't realise things in the world of avatar sites were doing so badly just now. I knew that some sites were having pretty epic problems.

I certainly hope mene doesn't die :cry:

RisikaFox
is bored... Amuse me? ^^
79.36
RisikaFox is offline
 
#3
Old 07-11-2010, 06:15 PM

This is a very sad announcement indeed. And a real shame too, because avatar sites consume about 90% of the time I spend on the internet. I'd hate to see them go extinct, as statistics seem to show.

iDanceWithSkeletons
The Dance Teacher of the Undead
218.03
Send a message via MSN to iDanceWithSkeletons
iDanceWithSkeletons is offline
 
#4
Old 07-11-2010, 06:15 PM

Wow... just wow... I didn't know about this... *is shocked*
I really hope Mene doesn't die aswell :cry:

Silver Magi
(◎_◎;)
77.04
Silver Magi is offline
 
#5
Old 07-11-2010, 06:16 PM

Agh, those numbers were depressing. D;
But it's true. Anime isn't as popular as it used to be.

I'm still trying to think of something else I could say, but I really can't. D:

Lilith W
bookworm
27757.86
Lilith W is offline
 
#6
Old 07-11-2010, 06:16 PM

Wow, donations really have gone down.

Tezonic
Nom Nom Nom
321.62
Send a message via MSN to Tezonic
Tezonic is offline
 
#7
Old 07-11-2010, 06:16 PM

I really wanted to tear up right there. :'(
I can see why the craze for anime suddenly dropped, but the hope for a new trend to start can all change right? o.O

Lixlaria
Devil Incarnite
1068.71
Send a message via AIM to Lixlaria Send a message via MSN to Lixlaria Send a message via Yahoo to Lixlaria
Lixlaria is offline
 
#8
Old 07-11-2010, 06:17 PM

Inso: Thank you for all the information. I didn't realize how much was behind running the site. I hope that Mene doesn't die. :cry: for that would be a sad day indeed.

Rad Lionheart
(ó㉨ò)
2981.04
Send a message via AIM to Rad Lionheart Send a message via MSN to Rad Lionheart
Rad Lionheart is offline
 
#9
Old 07-11-2010, 06:17 PM

Now I feel bad because I had to stop donating each month. D:

The Wandering Poet
Captain Oblivious

Penpal
112459.23
The Wandering Poet is offline
 
#10
Old 07-11-2010, 06:17 PM

Wow... well that clears up a lot... I'm glad you are honest about all of this though...

So... you say we must change to grow... but the big question is... how do we grow? We could put ads on menewsha and make menewsha not look as pretty as it used to... but help the site pay off its costs... which honestly I think would be an okay temporary, as personally there is a lot of space we do not use that could be filled to help find menewsha until a new plan is designed. That being said a lot of people will be against this.

I knew this site costs you a lot of money... and honestly I'm rarely a donor due to no money... but most of my reason is no money at all to spend.

o.o by the way... since when was anime not supposed to be popular? That's news to me...

Edit - Also like to state This idea I put in the feedback which might if it would work help cut at least some costs

Last edited by The Wandering Poet; 07-11-2010 at 06:22 PM..

Drop Bear
The myth or the legend?

Penpal
6548.46
Drop Bear is offline
 
#11
Old 07-11-2010, 06:17 PM

I knew the costs associated with running a site such as this would be high, but i figured the income would have been slightly larger too. In what ways though, can evolution of this site progress?

Inso, your honesty is appreciated, it shows great strength for a site admin to lay it bare like that for the members to see. Kudos.

Last edited by Drop Bear; 07-11-2010 at 06:20 PM..

M i r o
Comatose
12543.30
M i r o is offline
 
#12
Old 07-11-2010, 06:18 PM

I kinda figured that this will end up going that way.
The economy is not like it used to and people are leaving avatar forums with a snap of a finger. xD;

But Gaia was never popular in the beginning, it was small. It didn't get big until 05.
I'll just hope for the best for Mene to keep going, though. =/

@ Poet; Anime died out around the time Adult Swim stopped airing them on normal night-times.
*And when Cartoonnetwork destroyed Toonami.

Last edited by M i r o; 07-11-2010 at 06:22 PM..

zigbigadorlube
[-_-]~

Assistant Administrator
254279.08
zigbigadorlube is offline
 
#13
Old 07-11-2010, 06:20 PM

This is very, very insightful. thank you for opening my eyes to the current situation!

Wordstreamer
Nifty Fairy of the North
Penpal
3494.93
Send a message via Yahoo to Wordstreamer
Wordstreamer is offline
 
#14
Old 07-11-2010, 06:22 PM

How are you thinking about Menewsha changing/avoiding death? I was wondering if that part was going to lead into something else, or if it was just the conclusion. (Not to say that it's "just" the conclusion, because that is a pretty sad state of affairs--more me wondering.)

Mystic
(ο・㉨・&...
487.28
Mystic is offline
 
#15
Old 07-11-2010, 06:23 PM

Thanks for posting this. I think that maybe some members who are so against certain features that would help the site run better would maybe see why the money needs to be made and exactly where it is going.

Small ads would be a good idea if it will keep the site going. I would just hate to see Mene just shit down. =(

Snowberry
Annihilator of Cookies
5964.99
Snowberry is offline
 
#16
Old 07-11-2010, 06:23 PM

Unfortunately it looks like Menewsha needs a lot more than hope right now. :( -> To all the "I hope" comments. If enough revenue doesn't come in this baby is going to sink no matter how much hope there is. Hope can't put bread on the table, etc.

This is a mash your heads together to brainstorm a way to get more green coming in situation. >.< I'm curious about the evolve part as well. Are possible ideas on the table already? Or is this asking the community for ideas about evolving? Also, evolving in what way?

LilMissMollyPutz
The Grim Reaper in the... Pixels...
0.76
LilMissMollyPutz is offline
 
#17
Old 07-11-2010, 06:23 PM

Is there like a way that people can help without donating, cause some people can't donate due to fact of economy or parents. There has to be some way for that to happen

The Wandering Poet
Captain Oblivious

Penpal
112459.23
The Wandering Poet is offline
 
#18
Old 07-11-2010, 06:24 PM

@ Miro - oh.... that... I remember that kinda... though maybe we need to figure out how to "break off the anime tracks" then?

iDanceWithSkeletons
The Dance Teacher of the Undead
218.03
Send a message via MSN to iDanceWithSkeletons
iDanceWithSkeletons is offline
 
#19
Old 07-11-2010, 06:24 PM

I agree with the ads part. If it would be helping Menewsha to keep existing, I would definately be for it.
It would be such a shame if it would die.

I feel so bad for not being able to donate :cry: I would do it definately if I had more money :(

Last edited by iDanceWithSkeletons; 07-11-2010 at 06:28 PM..

Kongouseki
(っ◕‿◕)&...
13819.39
Kongouseki is offline
 
#20
Old 07-11-2010, 06:25 PM

that's rather insightful and sad.
i'd have to go with Miro, that it seems anime declined when Adult Swim stopped showing anime to the younger, newer watchers. anime grew in popularity when that channel had anime like Sailor Moon, Dragonball Z, Outlaw Star, Cowboy Bebop, et cetera, but they don't show great shows like that now that drummed up excitement for anime.

Freiheitsflugel
The Tokio Hotel worshipper...
709.49
Freiheitsflugel is offline
 
#21
Old 07-11-2010, 06:25 PM

Wow..I want to do something about it but I don't have a job to help out with the finances. If it weren't for the fact that I don't have a job I'd be donating every week. If Menewsha dies I won't have any other avatar site to turn to...

Foxy
Pirate Queen
7304.19
Foxy is offline
 
#22
Old 07-11-2010, 06:25 PM

Advertising is key. Find a really good SEO specialist.

Also, maybe create more things aside donating... such as lotteries and contests. Anything that will reward gold for real money--while keeping the prices low, of course.

Rhumbullion
The Rebel Prodigy
22972.98
Send a message via AIM to Rhumbullion Send a message via MSN to Rhumbullion Send a message via Yahoo to Rhumbullion
Rhumbullion is offline
 
#23
Old 07-11-2010, 06:25 PM

So what does this mean? I Mene going to die?

Ascadellia
(╯°□°)╯...
Penpal
13579.67
Send a message via MSN to Ascadellia Send a message via Yahoo to Ascadellia
Ascadellia is offline
 
#24
Old 07-11-2010, 06:26 PM

Mene might die if we don't get enough funds. T^T Nooo.

The Wandering Poet
Captain Oblivious

Penpal
112459.23
The Wandering Poet is offline
 
#25
Old 07-11-2010, 06:26 PM

@ Rhum - no... it means mene needs to evolve before it does...

 


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 

 
Forum Jump

no new posts