I make my bios for my characters and don't have any set thing I would put in them. Only if I need that section for a bio would I consider adding it, but mostly a very basic bio will say as much as a detailed bio if you write enough in the other sections.

But people really come and go like that in real life.

I know they do. But what if I can't think of a reason that won't make them sounds logical to appear later rather than earlier?
Anyway, My story haven't even reach half yet, there are still a lot of tiny details that NEED to work out to reach the main arc intention.

My main arc currently are key points/paragraph. Like.
7. Case A happen.
Objective is to kill enemy C, plant clue on leaving a locket behind.
Character 2 discover the symbols meaning.

My main arc is settle in terms of its objective and main things. but lol, the details to joint them, are still in the air, I have several ways to achieve the same arc, just the matter of which fits better. I have 6 notecards. I am now only half way on the 3rd card... so close to half now.

I have bad memory, I only remember the main arc. So even if I didn't write it down or use the discovery way, or just replace whatever I find, create when I need, I find it sloppy/forceful, not natural enough. I had tried the discovery way before... lol, it just happen that what I write at the back doesn't really match up to the front. It is the matter of remember and how long a pause I took in between, so I am better off writing it down and be a planner.

Originally Posted by xuvrette

I will just add it. I like to have intricate little seemingly unimportant detail, so I can flesh out their importance in next possible future story. I like to plant those unrelated things to the current plot, then I can use them more in future arc.

Something like foreshadowing? x.x The pet doves are cute... I really want them. Their main role was just delivering letters. Which is why i forgot about them. They really is not important at this main plot. They are name Dusk and Dawn... how can I not put them back in? After writing the whole draft, the first revision is to add the doves back. <33

Ooo! Good to hear that you're adding them back in since they're so important to you. My first thought is Harry Potter and grouchy what's his name the house elf in the black house. He seemed insignificant, and the director of the movies tried to leave him out since the 7th book wasn't out yet, and they didn't know his importance. You never know when a seemingly minor character is an important piece of the puzzle!

Perhaps somewhere down the line they become very important to your story. idk... like they discover the 2 star past (whatever it is to get to neverland) and come back covered back in fairydust, and their owner can now suddenly fly.

Originally Posted by Kat Dakuu

If I forgot a detail like that, I would take it as a sign that the detail doesn't need to be in the story. I would normally have added something else in that fills that role or something that negates the need for the role. I would never try to tell the story or character what to be.
(why do ya'll have to talk while I'm sleeping?! I missed good stuff)

I wanted to say on the impressions thing, that I wouldn't feel the need to have a section for it. It would probably be redundant. If in the description I write that he has long black hair always in his eyes, chains as belts, and spiked boots. But then, that he has a personality that's bubbly and always a dependable friends. Impression is dark emo boy. The appearance says it all. Since impression is 90% what people see no matter how much we say it isn't.

I apologize? I finally caught up in all my threads from overnight/early morning posters. took my daughter outside to play. came back in and have like...20 threads to respond to. I'm glad you thought we talked about interesting things though! Makes me happy to be a good conversation person. Because.. i'm crazy, that feels like an accomplishment and a compliment.

In my bios.. i don't really have a general description section (i mean really. my bios are ridiculously detailed. I'm gonna try to find it quick) So i like the idea of having an impressions section for a mental note to myself.
This is how this person is around new people type thing.
This is what they're like around friends.

The differences pf personality is insane for everyone in different situations, and i think its an amazing thought on how to flesh a character out more thoroughly.

---------- Post added 05-06-2013 at 02:14 PM ----------

Originally Posted by xuvrette

I know they do. But what if I can't think of a reason that won't make them sounds logical to appear later rather than earlier?
Anyway, My story haven't even reach half yet, there are still a lot of tiny details that NEED to work out to reach the main arc intention.

My main arc currently are key points/paragraph. Like.
7. Case A happen.
Objective is to kill enemy C, plant clue on leaving a locket behind.
Character 2 discover the symbols meaning.

My main arc is settle in terms of its objective and main things. but lol, the details to joint them, are still in the air, I have several ways to achieve the same arc, just the matter of which fits better. I have 6 notecards. I am now only half way on the 3rd card... so close to half now.

I have bad memory, I only remember the main arc. So even if I didn't write it down or use the discovery way, or just replace whatever I find, create when I need, I find it sloppy/forceful, not natural enough. I had tried the discovery way before... lol, it just happen that what I write at the back doesn't really match up to the front. It is the matter of remember and how long a pause I took in between, so I am better off writing it down and be a planner.

Omg is it a detective story?? The doves could be caught and used to send a ransom note :O

Unfortunately no. XD It is a fantasy.
But you see, I really really love mystery/detective, and how bad guys plant evidence to frame good guys. XD I am doing something like that. x.x It is heavily magic related though. and no, the above example is just an example. XD

Yes! You mention something right about Rowling. ... though I do have an impression that Rowling DO have a planning in spread sheet! I saw one of the handwritten spreadsheet for Goblet of Fire, not sure whether IS IT REALLY Rowling's. They claim it is... let me see if I can find it. Anyway, if it is genuine, Rowling DID some kind of planning at least. But then, not sure about whether she plan it across from Book 1 to 7.

Rowling have also planted seemingly unimportant clues in all her books. Whatever appear not important at front, turn out to be such a vital information at the back. *shakes head* Because my favourite book being Book 1, 2, 3, I remember them the most. About how I don't even care about Professor Quirrell, and yet he is the culprit, I was hook into thinking Snape is very suspicious. Then in Book 2, I was thinking about Malfoy, then it is set up by ANOTHER Malfoy. In book 3... I kinda forgot... x.x

anyway, let me try and find her spread sheet...

Name:
Gender: Age: Race:
Birth date:
Place of Birth:
Astrological Sign:
Chinese Zodiac Sign:
Blood Type:
Height: Weight:
Hair:
Eyes:
Religion:
Hobby:
Stereotype:
Body:
Physical Condition:
Birth Marks:
Scar:
Tattoo:
Freckles:
Clothing:
Piercings:
Likes:
Dislikes:
Fears:
Goals:
Occupation:
Allergies:
Most prized Possession:
Way of Speaking:
Psychological Condition:
Beliefs:
Problems:
Personality:
Role Model:
Favorite: Color- Least Favorite: Color-
Number- Number-
Word- Word-
Food- Food-
Relationships: Friends-
Enemies-
Crushes-
Abilities: Physical-
Magical-
Weapons-
Pets:
Possessions:
Home:
Lives with:
Mother: Father:
Siblings:
Children:

Okay so i found it. This is the bio sheet i've been using for one of my stories.

and i love the unofficial "official" plot idea books that came out in between books by mugglesnet i think? They guessed what might happen in the next book based on meanings of names. and all kinds of things. It was very fun to read. I'm hoping to actually reread them and see if they were right since i can't remember.

My hope is to at somepoint write a mystery novel. it would just take so much work because i would HAVE to lay everything out before hand.

Shadami: the conversation really is interesting!!
I just really don't like overly detailed bios. Seems pretentious to me, especially if you're going to share it with anyone. I would put all that information in the larger sections. Personality according to situation still just goes under personality. Plus, I think doing those super detailed bios I see online just lead to Mary Sues sometimes. If there are all those sections, it really makes you want to put something under every single one. Food allergies? Never thought of that, but now I like the idea so I'll do that. Pets? I think I'll have one of those too. Mental health issues? Sure, why not.
A pre-made bio influences the character.

Xuv: that's pretty natural for writing. To write a detail in, then realize later that you can use later to hang the most important part of the climax. We talk about that a lot in my writing workshop class. A lot of writers do that just by instinct with no planning. People have a sense of the shape of fiction if they read a lot and insert objects and people and such without them meaning anything, but by the end of the story, the writer is so glad they added that in because it's exactly what they need.

Oh god I think I like making new characters, is interesting, but sadly I suck doing them. I don't have enough of practise, and I'm unsure how their minds works. I definitely should write a full bio, or even give it a try. Though now I'm having little bit of problems with my inner writer - she absolutely loathes our read&write -course's teacher and refuses to create anything in her classes, so I'm just angsting in the middle of class doing nothing and thinking, how the sounds annoys me. (uhum, so the teacher won't let me listen music while in the class which is absolutely unfair when everyone else can chat and read and draw and for fuck's sake dance if they want to, but I can't listen music! Urgh!)

I think when I try to think, my brain stops working. Love you too, stinky brain ♥

Originally Posted by Kat Dakuu

Shadami: the conversation really is interesting!!
I just really don't like overly detailed bios. Seems pretentious to me, especially if you're going to share it with anyone. I would put all that information in the larger sections. Personality according to situation still just goes under personality. Plus, I think doing those super detailed bios I see online just lead to Mary Sues sometimes. If there are all those sections, it really makes you want to put something under every single one. Food allergies? Never thought of that, but now I like the idea so I'll do that. Pets? I think I'll have one of those too. Mental health issues? Sure, why not.
A pre-made bio influences the character.

Xuv: that's pretty natural for writing. To write a detail in, then realize later that you can use later to hang the most important part of the climax. We talk about that a lot in my writing workshop class. A lot of writers do that just by instinct with no planning. People have a sense of the shape of fiction if they read a lot and insert objects and people and such without them meaning anything, but by the end of the story, the writer is so glad they added that in because it's exactly what they need.

For me, i like having a generic bio like this that i can use for the story. And its true most characters will have several slots that say none or N/A. But once i fill out these bios, they're really just for myself, and my co author. most of the details don't even come out in the story.

and gee. i keep relating to J.K.Rowling... so you know all this information about a character, but it may never come to appear in the book itself. Just like Alot of Neville and Seamus's backgrounds. Neville still became a main character, but Seamus was actually suppossed to be much more of a main character and never made the cut .

---------- Post added 05-06-2013 at 03:18 PM ----------

Originally Posted by Mimmu

Oh god I think I like making new characters, is interesting, but sadly I suck doing them. I don't have enough of practise, and I'm unsure how their minds works. I definitely should write a full bio, or even give it a try. Though now I'm having little bit of problems with my inner writer - she absolutely loathes our read&write -course's teacher and refuses to create anything in her classes, so I'm just angsting in the middle of class doing nothing and thinking, how the sounds annoys me. (uhum, so the teacher won't let me listen music while in the class which is absolutely unfair when everyone else can chat and read and draw and for fuck's sake dance if they want to, but I can't listen music! Urgh!)

I think when I try to think, my brain stops working. Love you too, stinky brain ♥

can you handle earbuds? And does the teacher spend a lot of time on one side of the room compared to another? Do you have long hair? Are you allowed to wear hoodies with the hood up in class?

A secret trick i used on the few ocassions i actually needed music in class. One earbud in on a low volume. But you have the player in your pocket and tuck the wire under your shirt and bring it out the neck. you can than hide that it even exists with hair/hoodie.
And if anyone talks to you. You won't miss it, and they'll never know that you weren't really listening to them.

and practice is a good thing. Don't give up just because your bad at the beginning. Give it a shot. :] and if you enjoy doing it so mcuh. You'll soon be a master bio writer/character maker.

http://chandlermariecraig.files.word...g_outline2.gif I FOUND IT!... though after I found it, I was kind of confused how come the topic come to Rowling's spreadsheet. Anyway, since I go through 'all the trouble' to look for it, I am showing it. x.x Oh, sorry, and it seems to be Order of Phoenix. XD

Dakukuu~ well I don't have issues over being 'swayed' by what the detail have. I build the character sheet fresh from 0 for each story, so I just add it in, thinking more in terms of the plot needs, setting needs and the character needs. The story triangle.

Now I am not sure... I really do have bad memory. You see, when I was planning it, I am seeing the WHOLE picture of the plot, 100%. I brainstorm a lot of ideas and I might have thought of something for the doves to do when I was planning it. BUT when I start writing, I zoom in to 20%... so the rest of 80% I would just let it rest(which means forgetting about it...) and focus on the beginning.

I am not surprised if I went pass my half mark on the story, and SUDDENLY realise, "hey! That is why I thought of doves from the beginning!"... at card 5. perhaps. (now in card 3.) Since I still haven't touch it yet, I cannot pin point for sure whether the doves are indeed useful at the back or for future development.

About instinct... I am trying to cut down my long winded description. So I don't think I have much extra things left to use as a back up tool to complete the puzzle.

It drives me nuts seeing a N/A slot. Why even have that question in there if you have nothing to say about it?
I don't even know what I'm saying anymore....
This is the profile I use a lot, mostly after the story is already started, just to keep information straight. Sometimes I learn new things when I fill it out, but mostly not.

Name:
Age:
Appearance:
~hair
~eyes
~clothes
~tattoos/piercings/marks/other (only put in if my character has one)
Hobbies:
Likes:
Dislikes:
Occupation:
Family:
Personality:
Stories: (too keep track of where the character belongs)

If I'm trying to learn new things about my character, I use something I learned from a class--to make a list of 100 things about the character.

That's about what i use for roleplays. But for my actual story i'm working on that i'm hoping to get published one day. I want it to actually be well planned out. no loopholes.. i hope. for people to go. oh this character's back story changed? why?

i do like to try new ideas though to see how it works for me. i think i may try this 100 features challenge.

I have done the interview way before. It was interesting. xD

Mostly I write the profiles just not to forget things. If it's something I'm never going to forget like the fact, I don't go out of my way to write it down if it doesn't fit in my categories. And sometimes a bit of backstory ends up in family. I never just throw out names in that section. I write pretty much the same stuff out for rps and publishable stories. I put the same amount of thought into characters for both.

I've almost reached 100 for one of my rp characters even though that story just started. I'm just so in love with Shin. I used him as my username on my newest site. Always I sign I'm in love with my own character.

Kind of like making the perfect guy for yourself?

I just have a hard time putting as much thought into RP characters, because i never know how far its going to go . Or where the story will even head.
My own stories there's a little bit of a difference. SO i guess i just like putting in more effort for stuff i feel will last much longer.

I don't know about perfect guy. lol. He's just a really fun character to write.

Honestly, I can create a decently developed character in less than a day. Sometimes it's easier than others, but an rp can develop a character faster than I would on my own because of having to react to situations i wouldn't have thought of. It takes....about five minutes for me to have a fairly detailed image of the character and their personality which sometimes means I know family and history because that can affect personality. I close my eyes and just see a person and I gain a personality almost instantaneously from the pose/expression/appearance I imagined.

This is why I'm trying to sell characters. I have a giant folder on my computer called "potential OC's"of images and things. But I have no time and energy for all that. Plus, I just wish other people would write good characters.

Can you actually sell characters like that?

well....I'm selling basic profiles (on this site, not real money) for others to flesh out and use. I think it's kinda strange honestly to do something like sell characters, but I saw a similar slave market thing that was part of a guild/slavexmaster rp thing elsewhere. I don't think it's that much different than people putting out writing prompts, except it's more like character prompts.

There are such thing as character designers. But it is kinda rare. x.x

I write down things to not forget them, and yet I still forget them. T__T

doing something like character design for a game would be fun to me. Either conceptual to create the character, or the physical design aspect because that's what I've been doing for the last ten minutes for a drawing I'm doing.

At my place, I certainly never saw this kind of post in my online or newspaper job page.
But then, in gaming or advertising or animation credits, I tend to see the word Character Designers.
I guess they do have this kind over your side, not here... T__T

every single game has someone who designs the character's image. Games have art. Someone does the art. Something like Final Fantasy? HUGE work goes into the design for all those intricate outfits. It's the same for movies. The writing half of the design is does by script writers. Also something every game and movie has.

Yep, but I can't find it in my local (country size) job site. with that job title, character design.
I am guessing maybe it is hidden task under job title like... illustrator, game designer... etc.

i would LOVE to be a game designer. For every aspect of the designing. World buildng and ideas is my specialty. Details.... ehhh not so much. Coding.. its another language .. i literly can't learn it no matter how much i want to.

I'm so glad you guys are staying in here chatting even when i have to leave for parenting duties <3

and i would think it must be in the overall clump of game designer, and than in the field there is just specific specialties?

My brothers and dad work with software and programming.

I'm sure that must be it. It's such a specified field though. I know you can go to Disney with portfolios of character design to get a job, but I don't know how it works. I believe that's how Tim Burton got started.

Tim burton... omg his art is freaky. Good.. popular and stuff. but freaky. Nightmare before christmas terrified me as a kid and i still haven't given it a second chance.

But must game designer know computer codes? I absolutely have NO interest in it. x.x
I heard from my friends that studied Computer Science, coding seems to require a lot of maths. O__O