I would call them someone who is willing to stand up for themselves if need be, not really a word, but there ar other terms other than submissive and dominatn out there.

Also the biting arm thing feeling good is one way others know/ did find out I was masochistic.

This makes me feel rather confused or strange. I am a deranged child. I love watching others receive pain, giving the pain, and I love anything very morbid and gruesome.. But I know in my heart I would never actually give pain to anyone [I mean like in roleplays and all I can be VERY deranged] but I'm to calm to physically cause pain to someone. Now I love to stir up fights that may tear down someone's ego, but I try not to be blamed and pinpointed...

Which side are you on, if any?
Have you ever admitted this to anyone and been horribly turned down?
Ever been embarrassed by this?
When/how did you realize that you were either S or M?
What are your morals on this?
... anything else, you feel would make good conversation-matter ....

I'm a Masochist.
I have admitted it to some of my girlfriends and some of my boyfriends but i've never been turned down by any of them..
I've never been embarrassed by my Masochism.
I've just always been addicted to pain. I never really knew what Masochism was until i told my best friend that I enjoyed cutting myself and being cut. Then he was all "Oh, you're a Masochist?" so yeah.
My morals on it? Um, I don't really know.

I am curious how many people consider cutting self as being a masochist, or is it something people do to get rid of emotional pain? or is it the same thing.

Which side are you on, if any?

Sadist! <33

Have you ever admitted this to anyone and been horribly turned down?

I have admitted it and never been turned down.

Ever been embarrassed by this?

I have been embarrassed.. don't wanna talk about it though.

When/how did you realize that you were either S or M?

I've always loved causing people pain, so i've always known.

What are your morals on this?

Eh, don't have any.

Originally Posted by Uzura

Oh my. Oh my. Uzura is a bit of a closet pervert. Should she come out to post a comment?

Out of the two, I would say I'm a bit of a masochist. I like certain types of pains, but nothing to the extreme. I think it's really more of the anticipation that gets to me and that I have a submissive personality when it comes to the bedroom. I didn't fully realize this part of me until just recently, but it's been something I've thought about for a few years now.

As far as morals go, as long as it's not going against anyones will and precautions are taken, I've got nothing against what other people do. Just because I may not do the same doesn't make it wrong. We each have different feelings and needs afterall.

Yeah I'm the same way. Bit of a masochist. Not that much, but it's in me I know. It shows the most emotionally... I think part of it because I've been abused. But I noticed with my last bf too, same thing as you said.

I'm both masochistic and submissive. Mostly to my boyfreind who is thankfully Sadistic and Dominant. (wow automatic capitalization, i'm weird) However I didn't realize until after I started dating him. I don't think my parents would like or accept it so i keep it a secret.

I had a freind who was a male masochistic, but he was mostly submissive. However his girlfreind wasn't domanant at all, so maybe he was more domanant then he realized.

I haven't read all the posts in this thread, so sorry if my responses are duplicates of anything other people have said...

I'm neither sadistic nor masochistic, although I was interested in BDSM at one point and considered myself a switch. I told my friends and pretty much implied it to my boyfriend at the time, who was totally game for kink.

I am somewhat embarrassed about this now, but no more so than I am with any of the silly things I thought/did when I was younger.

Now that I've matured a little, I have some serious ethical problems with S&M, especially M/f.

It seems to me that hurting someone else physically is not a very healthy practice nor a good way of relating to each other, and I think the close cultural ties between sex and violence are troubling. I think the idea that violence can be the same thing as pleasure encourages the misconceptions that allow rapists to justify their actions ("but she secretly wanted it") or even get out of the legal, and I think the prevalence of rape fantasies supports this.

I also think M/f S&M is symptomatic of a misogynist culture. Since when is the eroticization of hurting women revolutionary?

I think the reason that we see violence as sexual is because our society (through movies, advertisements, books, pornography, and other cultural forces) relates them to each other. Examples of this include vampire novels (dangerous but attractive vampire loves girl despite the harm he inflicts on her; sounds eerily reminiscent of abuse situations where women tell themselves that despite a man's violence towards her, he loves her), Mr. & Mrs. Smith (the scene where they try to kill each other and wind up fucking is one of the best examples of the sexualization of violence in a mass film EVER), and plenty of other things I have neither the time nor desire to track down and list.

Also, I don't think the focus on consent solves any of this. Just because someone agrees to let you do something to you doesn't mean you should do it.

NOTE: I'm not calling S&M'ers rapists or bad people. I just don't think that they should engage in S&M.

Epoxy, yo are the first I know with this opinion for the record.

S and M has been around for ages, longer htan the mass media, and as such it has happened. I do not believe it has nor ever will justify rape, for rape is without consent, and S and M is and is something not only do both do, but both appreciate and are fully fine with is not something that is rape, nor comes from media, it is biological.

Which side are you on, if any?

I'd like to say that I'm sadistic, I like watching people squirm and I have been caught teasing my girlfriend about making a safe word and not letting her know about it. xD I wouldn't really do that though, I;d like to have a way out if I was ever on the other side of things.

Have you ever admitted this to anyone and been horribly turned down?

Nope, I've admitted to my girlfriend, she doesn't much care about it. xD

Ever been embarrassed by this?

I guess, kinda. xD

When/how did you realize that you were either S or M?

>.> Er.. I don't think I'm allowed to discuss, but it involves adult films? (if that's too much, lemme know.. I'll edit it out)

What are your morals on this?

I think that it's alright if both sides consent to it, if it's just senseless beatings then I don't think it's right at all.

... anything else, you feel would make good conversation-matter ....

Er.. no not really. xD
[/quote]

Originally Posted by d2hiriyuu

Epoxy, yo are the first I know with this opinion for the record.

I may be the first on this thread to express this opinion, but I am certainly not the
first to oppose S&M. Radical feminism beat me to it a long time ago.

I mean, when S&M includes things like this...don't you think I have at least a *teensy* bit of a point?

Originally Posted by d2hiriyuu

S and M has been around for ages, longer htan the mass media, and as such it has happened. I do not believe it has nor ever will justify rape, for rape is without consent, and S and M is and is something not only do both do, but both appreciate and are fully fine with is not something that is rape, nor comes from media, it is biological.

Sure, longer than mass media but not longer than patriarchal norms. I'm not saying mass media is the only thing that contributes to the sexualization of violence, but it certainly does seem to be a part of it.

I mean, if we want to start talking history, how about the Marquis de Sade? He's a key advocate of S&M as a sexual practice - and it's probably impossible to hate women any more than he did or to express it through a more violent form of sexuality.

Ok, amused by article, i guess a better thing about having this type of point as for having the article, i still don't agree with your point. as for the people who do the photoshoots, not something I would do, but they made a choice to act in htat type of show and filming in the first place. it is true for all porn stars in my mind, S and M or not. As for it being rape and abuse, there is a fine line between the two, but the line is still defined. People getting off on being raped is concerning, same goes for the male side of getting off raping someone, I don't agree that the girl should ask someone to, or the guy should do it, but with consent and willingness of both people, I don't find it a problem at all. it can still be safe, and there are many many precautions in S and M for making sure neither takes harm they don't want nor physical harm that is permanent.

Most of this, if not all is a big thing to discuss before hand, and to make sure everything is in place before hand. even if one person gets off whipping till the other bleeds, and the other doesn't like the concept of blood, they can choose to not whip at all, or never more than enough to cause a red streak (no blood).

As for mass media influence, i agree it doesn't help in the sense that people think they are interested in this kink/fetish without understanding the full amount of consequences it can have. That is a big problem with mass media in my mind though, and doesn't only apply to here.

Oh back on article, humiliation (possible sub topic of S and M, though not necessarily), is something that I don't at all liek the concept of, but I can easily find it acceptable depending on the degree. Some people like getting a shy girl to feel embarrassed, and I think humiliation comes from that, though not positive, but as a general note, the extreme versions of S and M are very disputable in comparison to it's lighter form. Also as a note, my stance on even the extreme stuff is don't let it effect a person's daily life style, whatever lifestyle it may be. And for record, there is also quite a few people who are into S and M, but agree fully that men and women should be equals about everything.

I guess I don't get why it's suddenly okay cause extreme physical harm to someone just because they consented.

I mean, I'm pretty willing to let the lower-level stuff slide. If people get off on spanking each other, uh, good for them I guess. They're not really hurting anyone, and it's probably not a whole lot more gendered than regular 'ol sex.

But drawing blood? Deep bruising? Literally beating the shit out of someone? It may be consensual, but there sure are people getting hurt...

Where do you draw the line? Or do you think it's okay to do anything to someone, no matter how maiming, as long as they let you?

Also, I honestly don't know what you're trying to say about rape fantasies, but I think that's an area where people are obviously reacting to patriarchal norms and social conditioning. It's probably not a healthy expression of sexuality.

Hm, I guess it is a bit weird cause I would have to be an extremist to understand fully, but even from what I knew, people who liked having their blood drawn and such is also some people who use to do it to themselves. So now it is just that they have someone else who can get them off (similar to the whole masturbating but on a different scale). Deep bruising isn't that hard in my mind to cause, but I have as huge pain tolerance so for me deep brusing actaully doesn't hurt necessarily. I don't get beaten mind you, but biting can cause it. (without blood).


I personally would draw the line as it hurts or affects my daily life (i.e. things broken as an extrme). I should be able to function nomally reguardless of everyhting else. To say what is not my taste, there are people who are fine with it, and even some really odd things that happen (i.e. people keeping others till point of starvation), personally not my thing, but if either doesn't want the abuse, a simple no will cause it to not happen again. Also for rape scenarios, it is normally more of a case where people like being taken and forced to not have control, so it can be consensual as a here are the guidelines of what can or can't be done (i.e. tied to chair is ok, but not forced to not speak) it is completely consensual, with guidelines and even the "victim" in the scenario, has the ability to still say no and have control.

Also "healthy scenario " of sexuality is weird cause there are stuff more obscure than S and M that I wouldn't call healthy but if that is what they want to do, then if it doesn't drag others to it, it is their choice.

I agree with d2hiriyuu, and I think as long both parts are OK with it, and have the control to say no, and stop before it gets out of hand, I don't think Its abuse, even though it might look so.

Where do you draw the line? Or do you think it's okay to do anything to someone, no matter how maiming, as long as they let you?

Well, No tbh I don't all is OK, even if the "victim" would allow me to do some things, It is still things I have to be able to stand up for, so even though for say, that I was let to break some ones legs, or that he/she wanted it, I would still not do it, though I would never want to do something I knew would deeply affect some ones life overall, So sure I think all has their limits, even if you have rape fantasies, I don't think the sadistic part, would do anything, though at least I would never do something against some one else, that I could not handle been done to me.

And I think the most(correct me if I'm wrong) would never hurt their submissive/masochistic partner to an extent that they don't think they them self could cope with.
But that's may be 'cause I'm sadomasochist.

But I have to agree though for an outsider, It can look really scary and abusive, even though it is on both the S and M's terms

I'm a sadist, but sometimes I like to switch and be masochistic. It's really hard to find sadistic girls though so it's not easy to be on that side of the table.

Originally Posted by Tomten

Well, No tbh I don't all is OK, even if the "victim" would allow me to do some things, It is still things I have to be able to stand up for, so even though for say, that I was let to break some ones legs, or that he/she wanted it, I would still not do it, though I would never want to do something I knew would deeply affect some ones life overall, So sure I think all has their limits, even if you have rape fantasies, I don't think the sadistic part, would do anything, though at least I would never do something against some one else, that I could not handle been done to me.

A sadist quite often is like that, well the actual sadists are like that, they understand the pain amount and will not give beyond what someone can take. And also I agree whole heartidly with the affects shouldn't effect ones overall life. There are the occassional accidents form what I understand of where people go a bit too far, but they do not intend to kill their partner.

And I think the most(correct me if I'm wrong) would never hurt their submissive/masochistic partner to an extent that they don't think they them self could cope with.
But that's may be 'cause I'm sadomasochist.

But I have to agree though for an outsider, It can look really scary and abusive, even though it is on both the S and M's terms

Yes it is true that sadist and dominants will not hurt their submissive/ masochistic partner to the extent that either one couldn't cope with. example of light version, a S will not pull a M's hair if hair pulling was a traumatizing thing for the M. alternatively, a S will not leave an M locked and chained in the back yard due to not wanting to abandon their partner. Even if the activity/ torture is something the other likes, if one doesn't like it, they won't do the activity. The same can be said for regular sex, or any regular relationship, if the girl says she doesn't want to have sex, the guy will respect that, and if the guy doesn't want to have clothes off, the girl won't push the issue and do so anyway. The activities of whipping, tying up, gagging etc is all the same type of agreement. There is always discussion of what will happen and how comfortable someone is with it way before the activity happens.

Good example from me for this, about whipping, when it was brought up as a what do you think of it, I didn't really know myself, but my partner brought it to my attention my breathing changed, we discussed for a bit, and came down to, I am fine with it when it is not going to cause bleeding, nor burn for days. As such, I rarely get hit/ whipped with anything, and when it is, it is either lightly with leather cords or with something odd like socks or a belt from a bath robe (long peice of fabric). So nothing that causes too much pain.

Which side are you on, if any?

I'm both, but I lean more towards a sadist. XD;

Have you ever admitted this to anyone and been horribly turned down?

Yes I have admitted it, and no it didn't affect my relationships, if that's what you mean by "turned down".

Ever been embarrassed by this?

No, I'm not embarassed of my nature. I actually kind of enjoy it.

When/how did you realize that you were either S or M?

Um.. I don't really remember when I realised what I was. (Also, I always thought S&M meant slave and master. LOL)

I'm very controlling and very dominate in the bedroom. My husband likes the fact that I'm not afraid to whip him. I won't do anything that hurts him badly though. I do have limits and I won't draw blood or do anything that leaves much of a bruise or anything like that.

Most the time I won't let myself be submissive. I have some control issues and just don't feel comfortable being the one being beat on. Although I do let him on occasion be the dominate one just to even things out.

Mystic, that is amusing I msut admit, the bruses thing, define hard bruise, cause from what I know and have had, a simple bite will bruise, but will a whip have a harder time bruising.

Well personally... I hate causing pain to others... but I figure if both sides like giving/receiving I don't see why you can't. I'm more the kind of person who's overly gentle. I don't mind... but... "gentle" is supposedly un-guy-like >.< making me look feminine or something >.<

I mean I believe that if someone who likes causing pain and someone who likes receiving pain are causing/receiving pain to each other I think it's probably fine...

Which side are you on, if any?
I'm mainly a female sadist, although I don't mind a bit of masochism.

When/how did you realize that you were either S or M?
Boyfriend, unfortunately for him haha.

I don't work with physically sadism. I love putting my boyfriend through mental torture though. I love picking at what makes him snap, at what makes him sad, etc. He's not really a masochist, so I respect his boundaries and remind him that I do love him haha.

@ d2hiriyuu and Tomten:

It's a choice, but I don't think it's a particularly good choice...

I don't know, I'm just sort of suspicious of power relations and inflicting physical harm in general. Especially if it's extensive harm. It just doesn't seem like a healthy way of relating to other people, and I think a more healthy and equitable relationship would probably be a better one.

Obviously a lot of people disagree.

I've always been interested in BDSM relationships, and I'm pretty sure I'm masochistic myself. I don't judge, and I know that any healthy BDSM relationship makes sure that the safety and well being of both partners is respected.

But I've never actually been in a serious BDSM relationship, nor do I plan do. Some of the aspects of it interest me and there are definitely some things I want to try with my husband once I eventually get married. I'm waiting for marriage to have sex, but I'm already planning it out. xD

But some of the heavier stuff, like chains, whipping, etc., isn't for me. Just a bit of light bondage and light spanking is enough for me I think. :)

I can see where you are coming from, Epoxy, but you should read this link.

The difference between BDSM, D/s, S&M, etc. and rape and violence is that the former are consensual fetishes, while the latter are not consensual, in which case there is an attacker and an unwilling victim. There is a world of difference between causing pain and causing harm. I would not let some random dude slam me against furniture and such without putting up a fight, but when my boy does it, I let him and actually encourage it because in that scenario, it's enjoyable for me. Likewise, there are some things I would like to do but refrain from because I am not sure if my partner would enjoy it. Dominance and submission is a higher form of intimacy for me and I believe it can be a perfectly healthy part of a relationship.