Right now i only know two of his Bill's that he is trying to do
the Education Bill and the Health Care Bill.
the Education Bill has to do with longer school hour's
and maybe school on the weekends.
the Health Care Bill is i think about giving insincere to those that need it.
Well that's what i think of it at least?
What do you think of the Bill's that Obama is trying to do?

O and if you know any other Bill's that Obama is trying to pass and or do
post it on this Thread.

Thanks for reading and or posting,
and try not going :offtopic: .

:boogie:

O and do you know whos paying for all
of these Bill's and Plan's of Obama hhmm
well I'll tell you people
those that make more then $200,000 and businesses
that's who...

Didn't the health care bill get voted down by Congress anyway? :\ There goes that idea.

I haven't heard about the education bill, but I do live under that rock over there :D What exactly is it supposed to do?

don't know anything about the health one, but I'm half supporting the school one, half not.

For a world leading country we have god-awful education and it's only getting worse every year (as a whole, since obviously there are the high achieving A students in every class year). Kid are seriously getting dumber and more lazy with each graduating class. My mum is a teacher in high school and I just finished up college and saw it, every new year coming in is more idiotic than the last. There are kid even graduating from school (in part because of Bush's "no child left behind crap policy) who still can't write an essay properly.

Granted this means 1) more educational days and 2) (really more important that the first) better teachers. So many come in that can't teach to save their lives (even if they know their stuff) and let classrooms get out of control.

Countries such as Japan that have school all year around have far smarter children. Now, I'm not saying to go as crazy as they are, they have cram schools and all that sort that cause kids to have high anxieties and (from what I've heard) have a higher suicide rate amongst kids because off all the pressures (cram schools, having to take intense tests to get into better schools, etc), but having more educational day will hopefully help brighten the coming generations.

okay this is what I know

* Reduce long-term growth of health care costs for businesses and government
* Protect families from bankruptcy or debt because of health care costs
* Guarantee choice of doctors and health plans
* Invest in prevention and wellness
* Improve patient safety and quality of care
* Assure affordable, quality health coverage for all Americans
* Maintain coverage when you change or lose your job
* End barriers to coverage for people with pre-existing medical conditions

This is from http://www.healthreform.gov/about/index.html

Basically... He wants to make health care affordable for all... My problems with the Health Care Reform have to do with me being middle class. If you know anything about insurance you know that your Insurance company pays for a certain amount of your bills. Obama wants to make it so that everyone can get affordable GOVERNMENT insurance which means that we will get a new tax... which sucks if your middle class or lower. On top of that tax you will probably have to pay a certain amount to the Government Insurance Company... so its like having insurance but your paying taxes on it to. that part where it says

Protect families from bankruptcy or debt because of health care costs

means that if your Family is poor and has to pay a lot of money to a doctor but can't pay the government will help you out... which means that if your middle class all your tax money is going to the people who can't afford their payments...

Normally i am a charitable person... But where i am financially makes it kinda sucky that the government wants to take my hard earned cash, charge me more for my Health insurance and then give it all to the poor... when in reality I am barely making rent and eating ramen for dinner. I used to think about how much i would like health care reform if only they would take money from the people who make just a bit more than i do... But really those people worked hard to get where they are... some of them grew up in penniless families worked hard all their lives to get into a better situation...

I don't mind being Charitable... I HATE when I am Punished by a Socialist President that gives to the lazy poor and takes from the hard working Working Class.

I like the idea of Health Care Reform... i just want a better plan.
------------------

School Bill : I haven't heard anything about a bill... except for the one banning Religion from schools.

This bill i actually liked it basically said that school funds can't go towards anything having to do with religion. It didn't say kids couldn't pray. It just said that the school could not financially support any religions. Which includes letting Christian, Muslim, Jewish, Mormon, Hindu, and so on... After School Groups meet on school grounds. Which personally i agree with. Government should be separate from Religion and this bill was a step in the right direction.


Is there another school bill out there that i don't know about?

The health care bill he wanted to pass would force people to get insurance, which may not be affordable to all and it would penalize those who did not get the insurance with a heavy fine.
I find that to be a BS proposal.
If we can't afford the insurance, what makes him then we could afford those fines?

I'm not sure what I think of the health care bill yet. :/

I am sure that the education bill is a load of crap. Increasing school hours/days isn't going to help everyone. The small percent it will help could eventually get over stressed and tired. I know from personal experience that school is no place I'd want to spend most of my time. Not because it was /school/, but because of my idiotic peers. You all know the ones. The kids that feel it necessary to pick out one or two people each year to make their lives living hell. :/ If I had to spend more hours there, and the weekends too, I think I honestly would have killed myself before I even got into high school.

Obama's not exactly my favorite person anyway though, so I could be biased.

The school bill would not be good in one sense. Parents make plans on the weekends and usually have time off. Kids need a break and only have an attention span of so long and longer school hours would be unproductive unless there are more hands on activities that include active learning as opposed to the classic lecture style of teaching. I know in Japan they go to school six days a week. There is also a lot more pressure on those over there I would guess. You know how the old saying goes, too much work and not enough play can make someone quite dull.

I really don't know how I feel about the health bill. Forcing people to get insured weather they may or may not be able to afford it, is a bad deal to begin with. To some, it would mean not being able to pay rent or utilities or be able to buy enough food. I'm not so sure what works in Canada/UK will work over here. I hear horror stories of people dying because they had to wait or it wasn't feasible for them to receive the proper health care they needed in preventative medicine. On one flip side of the issue, there are a lot of people who aren't getting any health care now.

I really have mixed feelings The school no, health care-- still needs a lot of work although I would have to do to make it workable.

I don't know much about these bills. I'm all for health care. But I wonder how the money for it will be raised. As for longer school hours.. Well that doesn't really effect me because I'm in college now.
However, many schools across the world have longer school hours and are in school longer. Such as Japan. I guess thats the only one I really know for sure, but I think it can be a good thing. I wonder what the reasons for making school longer are. I guess I should look these things up...

I think if children were going to get educated, they could do it in half the time they're currently condemned to, so I think that's idiotic. Also, history has proven that whenever the government takes over anything for "everyone" or on a large scale, or really tries to run anything, it becomes a nightmare of waiting lists and red tape. Just talk to anyone from a country with socialized health care, and you will hear how great it's NOT.

Finally, unlike what the folks on the left want everyone to believe, the rich are NOT going to be footing the bill. They CAN'T foot the bill, even if you could get all of them to stop dodging all of their taxes. There simply aren't enough rich folks out there to foot the bill. New York, for instance, kept upping it's taxes on the rich, and what happened? The rich started leaving New York.

What really DOES happen, however, is that the middle class (many of whom are already on the slippery slope to poverty), get the squeeze. Ultimately, the national debt is already one we can't pay. Democrats LOVED to rip republican spending anywhere they knew about it. What this president is doing makes anything they did like candy bars versus caviar.

In any case, wise man say: $#it rolls downhill. Put the squeeze on the rich man, and the rich man starts laying off the poor men that work for him to cut corners. In the end it's the guy on the bottom of the food chain who ends up in a tent city wondering what happened, in this glorious age of free lunches, that he wound up there.

Wake up people. We cannot spend any more money we don't have. Read your history books about economical collapses around the world, and WHY those economies collapsed. Then compare it to what is happening in the US right now. Other countries as of this moment are wanting nothing more than they have to do with the US dollar, which they KNOW will amount to mere paper when, at last, the crap hits the fan because of our economic irresponsibility that is now coming home to roost. They know, because half of them have gone down the same drain at one point in their history or another, so they know the signs of it. (Not that they'll tell you about it on CNN... Just imagine the rush on the banks if everyone was well read on the topic and people knew the half of it.)

When people from communist countries are saying that the US is a picture of their country just (historical) moments before it went communist and went down the drain... that's kind of disturbing.

A little visual aid... (hope the pic works)

http://market-ticker.org/uploads/Key...tPresent20.png

@ Yorihiko - you are forgetting one thing, you need to spend money to make money. Think the Great Depression. We only really started to recover from that BECAUSE the government spent a crap ton of money by making more jobs (many government related, there were even programs where the government paid artists to make art... I think it was called WPA... don't take my word on it though). They also created welfare, which means they have to dish out millions of dollars because before then nothing existed to help the poor people, so whole families were starving to death on the streets.

Plus the government had to dish out millions to make millions as far as the war was concerned (the US made many artillery based things for the Allies mixed into WWII). So the US entered the Great Depression in 1929 and didn't officially exit it until the early 40's and even then it took many more years after that to make a full on recover, it was just by the early 40's that we had enough money and jobs circulating that things were rebounding.

That's why I don't get people all up in arms saying "Obama sucks because the economy is still bad" blah blah blah. We've been in a recession for 2-3 years now and it STARTED with Bush. Obama just was handed the economic issues. Not to mention, he hasn't even been in office a year yet. It take years in and of itself to recover from a recession as bad as we are in (which isn't as bad as the Great Depression, but many say this is the worst economic crisis since then) and, even though it sucks, it means you have to spend money. Part of the problem with recessions is everyone hoards their funds (which is understandable) but then money isn't circulating in the system and things get worse. The stimulus stuff was an attempt to get people out there spending money and help boost the economy, but a lot of people end up hording the extra cash anyway. So it wasn't the best plan out there, but in some cases it helped. It's been claimed things are slowly starting to get better.

I'm against the school one, I have enough stress in my life and I don't need a longer day or my weekends, which are my breaks to be taken, if he wants he can make year round schooling, that's fine, just don't take away weekends and nights, some of us have to work or want to do extra curriculars.

I'm not for the health care one much either. Why should I pay for someone elses health care? If anything, he should just lower the cost. Not to be rude, but there are lots of people out there who need healthcare, some deserve it, but most don't. Therefore I don't think I should pay for the lazy bums to have healthcare, now if the family is struggling, sure I'd donate a few dollars, but you can't tell when the money comes from your taxes.

Originally Posted by Erailea

@ Yorihiko - you are forgetting one thing, you need to spend money to make money. Think the Great Depression. We only really started to recover from that BECAUSE the government spent a crap ton of money by making more jobs (many government related, there were even programs where the government paid artists to make art... I think it was called WPA... don't take my word on it though). They also created welfare, which means they have to dish out millions of dollars because before then nothing existed to help the poor people, so whole families were starving to death on the streets.

The "government" does not have any money. Do you really think that the president or some rich guy named Uncle Sam is sitting in the White House cutting checks from his own pocketbook? Where do you suppose "government" money comes from? It's called TAXES. Which means, it's NOT free. It doesn't just come out of nowhere. Which means Obama hasn't got millions or billions or trillions to spend, because WE haven't got it. And if he tries to get it from us, it's going to make the great depression look like years of plenty, especially for the disappearing middle class, which is disappearing because it is being taxed to death. Of course since our money is paper, backed only by the good faith of the people (like the money of any dying country whose leaders decide to horde the gold and silver because they know it's dying... and also why the Ron Paul gold dollar caused such an uproar and was literally seized by the US government from private citizens)... they can always print more. But what happens if we do print more is itself the hole in the belly of the sinking economy.

Finally, the economic disaster did not start with Bush. It started with the US Government "kicking the can" (knocking the problem down the road by artificial means) in the way it did, back a LONG time before bush. In what way? Oh, in the same exact way that we kicked the can just before the great depression, in such a way that ultimately CAUSED the great depression. So what did the financial wizards of our time implement to save our bacon? "I know! Let's do the same thing that led us into disaster before, only... let's do it a lot, lot more this time, and see if it works!"

The result will obey the same rules that the "solution" did just before the great depression, leading to an even bigger collapse, proportionate to how much we magnified or inflated the idiotic solution we thought up back then.

I might add, that just before everything ultimately crashed during the great depression, right up to the last minute the government was saying via the media, "hey, folks... don't worry! It's all over! We're on the upswing now! There's no crisis! We're not in a depression! Things are looking up now!" And I might add that the things being said about our economic situation right now match almost literally (I kid you not), word for word, the quotes of what was being said then.

Obama's solution? Let's throw an a-bomb on the fire! Let's get so far in debt that even if the economy might not have collapsed before, it sure as heck will now!

Money doesn't grow on trees. Or in Uncle Sam's pockets. Or in Obamas. And the more that's taken from the pockets of the people who DO have it (such as the pockets of businessmen who do the hiring), the less there is going to be for anybody else. The super rich, especially the corrupt rich, will always dodge most, if not all of their taxes, on all kinds of ridiculous technicalities. The honest rich will probably disagree with the country robbing them of every penny they have simply because they were successful, and so have to resort to similar legal yet undesirable ways out. Unlike people waiting for a free lunch, they have mega-businesses to keep afloat. Just who does that leave to pay for this magic carpet ride? I'm betting it won't be Santa Claus.

Geez, it's hard to tell whether Obama is actually doing any good. I keep hearing people complaining about all the bills they don't want passed and never hear about the positive things that are happening.

I heard about the Health Care Reform bill, and all I can say about it is that Obama is to socialistic for my taste, I don't want my tax money going to others that are poor. Not in a selfish way but more in a way of that money could be going to bringing the US out of debt. Another thing i dont care for about the bill is that it helps people that dont want to work. For example if a bum got hit by a car (lord forbid) and needed medical assistance, my tax money would go to this person that has no money and no means of making money other than begging. Also when you go to a government run system of health care it cuts out the competition that is nessessary to find cures to diseases. If their isn't the potential for a big return on the hard work done, then the people (researching cures) have no reason to be pushing to find cures. Competition is in human nature and Government run health care cuts that out.
As for the school bill, i hadn't heard about it until today, but if I was forced to be in school more, on weekends, or during the summer, I don't think I would be alive at the present moment. More hours in school doesn't exactly help students that are bored with school, or don't want to be there, it only helps if the student is struggling and honestly wants to learn the material.

As this is turning into a debate on political beliefs, I will be moving it to the debates forum :)

Originally Posted by Calixte Dae

The health care bill he wanted to pass would force people to get insurance, which may not be affordable to all and it would penalize those who did not get the insurance with a heavy fine.
I find that to be a BS proposal.
If we can't afford the insurance, what makes him then we could afford those fines?

It sounds like you're talking about the Baucus bill, which would penalize people for not getting health insurance with a $1500 fine and doesn't include a public option. It's still in the Senate Finance Committee and yes, as it is right now, it's a total piece of crap.

Funding abortion, killing the elderly, taking money from the people who earned it, extending school hours, making poor people who cant afford insurance do time.
this man is out of control!
he only got in office from playing the "race card".
everyone is regreting voting for him now.
forget being "tested" he is dragging this world to hell.

I cannot stand his blasphemey, or his worshipers.

The health care thing seems fine but the school thing BURN IT BURN IT WITH FIREEEE.

Originally Posted by Yorihiko

When people from communist countries are saying that the US is a picture of their country just (historical) moments before it went communist and went down the drain... that's kind of disturbing.

Ah historical materialism, the belief that all societies are following a unilineal evolutionary path. Furthermore unlike other nineteenth century evolutionist theories, this held that there was an end stage to social evolution. Something which we were all heading towards and destined to which. Do you know what the name of this supposed final stage of our evolutionary progress was called? Yep it was given the title of communism, when societies lived without States and Classes. Now this brings me to my question, which Stateless, classless societies are you referring to? Surely you are not so ignorant of Political and Anthropological theory as to confused a Socialist State for Communism as that would just be silly.

Originally Posted by Yorihiko

Also, history has proven that whenever the government takes over anything for "everyone" or on a large scale, or really tries to run anything, it becomes a nightmare of waiting lists and red tape.

I know, right? The State has never managed to do a single thing right in history. One only needs to look at examples such as South Korea and China to see how much of a joke State involvement in economic growth. For as long as the State has had anything to do with their economies they have seen nothing but failing economies. Another nice example is shown with Toyota and the protectionism efforts from the State of Japan. Oh how badly that killed their business, instead of helping their industries to develop it resulted in in a nightmare and red tape. The same holds true if we look at certain steel industries. Thankfully USA was able to grow their economy without any State interference. For there has never been any protectionism or State involvement in that economy.

Yep the State can not do ANYTHING without killing the economy.

I didn't hear about the school bill.
The healthcare bill is rediculous. It basically said everyone has to have health insurance. and if they do not get it, they will receive fines.

tell me this obama: how is that supposed to help people get health coverage, when in reality you are only making their situation worse?

@saya- I didn't hear about him funding abortion or killing the elderly. I don't think he has "worshippers" either.
I prefer to think of him as another idiot president that some religious figure. I don't think this has anything to do with religion at all.

I'm a bit on the fence about all the bills he's trying to fling around. The Health Care was ridiculous. Our country is way too big for a unified health care system. It sounds all nice and dandy on a piece of paper but once you get it out on streets, it blows.

I've tried paying attention to the news and listening carefully but it's just mumbo jumbo most of the time. I was kind of shocked when people were saying he was going to have...what was it called again a 'death council' or something in those lines. How did having a little meeting with your doctor about your future plans translate into a whole death council?

As for the Education Bill. I was a bit confused when I heard about this. But in reality we do need this. Getting into college/university is ten times harder than it was in the times of my parents. Even two or three years ago it wasn't this damn hard. I think we do need longer school hours. But I believe they'll be doing this on the newer generations and then slowly introducing it so they're use to it.

We need some improvement in our education system. No. Not some. MAJOR MAKE-OVER. Kids are getting dumber and lazy, like people have said in the thread. Longer hours=less homework, at least...that's what I hope.

@Saya I think you have your information a little confused. I don't think the Health Care even covers abortion OR kills the elderly.

Originally Posted by Calixte Dae

The health care bill he wanted to pass would force people to get insurance, which may not be affordable to all and it would penalize those who did not get the insurance with a heavy fine.
I find that to be a BS proposal.
If we can't afford the insurance, what makes him then we could afford those fines?

You have to get it because people who don't have insurance but have to go to the hospital MUST be treated. It's the law that these people HAVE to be treated, and part of an oath that doctors take.

So, when people without insurance come to the hospital, and they have to be treated (which is fine; everyone deserves health), they cost thousands and thousands of dollars to tax payers and the government. More than if they had insurance.

It's not like they're trying to punish you; there are reasons behind these things.

It's ridiculous for people to NOT support the health care bill. Why is health something which is reserved for rich? One hundred and twenty two people die every day simply because they don't have the money to pay for the things they need - does that sound right to you? Does it sound like an ethical, humane thing to happen in a first world country? People who have insurance and work hard for it are still having to pay ridiculous amounts for care that they were supposed to be covered for because they had "preexisting conditions". But, hey, thanks to your opposition, that's gone! Yay, corporate corruption!

Don't buy into the fear mongering, everyone. Go read about a country with similarities to this battle. The Swiss are a good start.

Originally Posted by Saya5933

Funding abortion, killing the elderly, taking money from the people who earned it, extending school hours, making poor people who cant afford insurance do time.
this man is out of control!
he only got in office from playing the "race card".
everyone is regreting voting for him now.
forget being "tested" he is dragging this world to hell.

I cannot stand his blasphemey, or his worshipers.

WARNING. FEAR MONGERING AND PROPAGANDA AHEAD.
Mind putting a warning on your post??

No, there are no "death panels". He will not "kill the elderly". He is not funding abortion.
Try again. Go do some research from sources other than FOX news, why don't you?

Originally Posted by Kris

WARNING. FEAR MONGERING AND PROPAGANDA AHEAD.
Mind putting a warning on your post??

No, there are no "death panels". He will not "kill the elderly". He is not funding abortion.
Try again. Go do some research from sources other than FOX news, why don't you?

Next you are going to try and tell us that he is not secretly building a Death star. :angel:

Although I share in your frustration that the political culture is tainted by people who are so easily sucked into propaganda. You see it from everything to ignorance with bills such as this to ignorance of the most basic of ideologies and theories.

As for the education bill, unless they are going to seriously start addressing the social, cultural and political causes behind why certain groups are being more negatively represented in grades the problem will continue to exist. Programmes such as Head Start are quite a good approach. Such a shame clowns like Jenson continue to hold so much influence.