Originally Posted by NightxProjectile

I don't mind Wicca or Paganism. I like that they accept different lifestyles (especially gay/lesbian cause I support them). I don't have any opinion of them, cause truth is I don't know too much about them. I would like to learn about them though. I think it's a bit interesting.

Yes, we are pretty open about that kind of stuff. We don't discriminate...Its horrible to do that and say that people are going to hell for their sexuality. >.<

Its not like homosexuals have a choice to be a, well, homosexual. I certainly didn't wake up one say day and say, "Hey, I want to be gay! 8D" That's just stupid...

I will tell you as much as I can, but I cannot tell you what I actually DO. But I can tell you where Wicca came from, who created it, what it is...that kind of stuff. I can tell you SOME things about Paganism, but I'm not Pagan and don't know much about it as I do Wicca.

I'm not overly fond of Wicca... or rather, the Wiccans themselves, if you get what I mean.

I've run into very few... actually, to be honest, I've never MET a true Wiccan. Just a lot of people that like to cast spells, "be one with nature", cite the Wiccan reeds to sound zen, bash on "close-minded religions", and completely ignore the fact that Wicca is about duality (God + Goddess) and only pay attention to the Goddess.

They get their pentacles at Spenser's and their tarot cards from a 5 dollar bin at Barnes and Noble while looking up spells involving elements or love OR books about the zodiac. The ones that are the super-feminists are even WORSE.

Basically, it seems like a big joke to me. Honestly, I like a lot of the ideals of Wicca and I think if more people took it seriously (and didn't seem to have such a holier than thou attitude mixed in with their super-zen-nature crap), I'd like it a lot more.

I think this is mostly because I was one of those terrible Wiccans myself when I was younger, which makes me so aware of the things I dislike about it rather then the things I do like about it.

So, to round it out... here are the things I DO like about Wicca:

1. In general, it is a more tolerant religion (at least when it comes to minorities like gays)

2. The whole, "An' it harm none, do what ye will" shtick. Very good over-arching rule.

3. The expression of male and feminine dualities. I'm not fond of how people have a tendency to take this literally (like GOD and GODDESS, even though they're part of the same whole) or how they have a tendency to praise one side and ignore the other ('Praise the Goddess!', 'Goddess help me!'), but it's still a nice concept.

4. It's connection and respect for older pagan/celtic/whatever traditions.

Originally Posted by Merrow

I'm not overly fond of Wicca... or rather, the Wiccans themselves, if you get what I mean.

I've run into very few... actually, to be honest, I've never MET a true Wiccan. Just a lot of people that like to cast spells, "be one with nature", cite the Wiccan reeds to sound zen, bash on "close-minded religions", and completely ignore the fact that Wicca is about duality (God + Goddess) and only pay attention to the Goddess.

They get their pentacles at Spenser's and their tarot cards from a 5 dollar bin at Barnes and Noble while looking up spells involving elements or love OR books about the zodiac. The ones that are the super-feminists are even WORSE.

Basically, it seems like a big joke to me. Honestly, I like a lot of the ideals of Wicca and I think if more people took it seriously (and didn't seem to have such a holier than thou attitude mixed in with their super-zen-nature crap), I'd like it a lot more.

I think this is mostly because I was one of those terrible Wiccans myself when I was younger, which makes me so aware of the things I dislike about it rather then the things I do like about it.

So, to round it out... here are the things I DO like about Wicca:

1. In general, it is a more tolerant religion (at least when it comes to minorities like gays)

2. The whole, "An' it harm none, do what ye will" shtick. Very good over-arching rule.

3. The expression of male and feminine dualities. I'm not fond of how people have a tendency to take this literally (like GOD and GODDESS, even though they're part of the same whole) or how they have a tendency to praise one side and ignore the other ('Praise the Goddess!', 'Goddess help me!'), but it's still a nice concept.

4. It's connection and respect for older pagan/celtic/whatever traditions.

No…I don’t know what you mean…Its kind of an insult if you claim to be Wiccan yourself.

I’m a true Wiccan. I was initiated at 18, which is the traditional way. And though being initiated isn’t REALLY necessary, I think it would be better. Being Wiccan is not all about casting spells, but it is a big part of being a witch. Being one with nature plays a major part. You have to respect nature, feel happy around it, feeling magick in the air.

Some of us Wiccans feel…I don’t know how to put this…Maybe sometimes uncomfortable with closed-minded religions, such as Catholicism and Christianly. Christians are usually closed minded about other religions and call them Satanist because they think only their beliefs are right. And I HAVE been a practicing Catholic. And I thought Wicca was bad, too, until I ACTUALLY read about it, and found it a lot more open than a Catholic would be. So, I chose to become Wiccan. And I am. We do not only pay attention to the Goddess, but I think it is true that the Goddess is mentioned more, like ‘Praise the Goddess, he’s here!’ or ‘Thank the Goddess that didn’t happen!’ The Goddess and God are whole, and that’s how they are viewed. It doesn’t necessarily mean we only pay attention to the Goddess.

I’ll admit, my pentacle was purchased at Spencer’s, but when you have Catholic parents who won’t buy a very nice looking one off the internet….Well, what can you do? I have two decks of tarot cards, purchased at a book store, but they were NOT five dollars. There were a lot more expensive than that. And learning about as much as you can about spells and how to do the ritual isn’t bad knowledge, though being a witch, you should learn about ALL spells, and what they are for, as well as the tools. And knowing the zodiac is a good thing…

Wicca IS about nature, and if you don’t like it…then its not for you. Goddess and God are in everything, in the trees, grass, moon, sun…Nature.

Sorry to hear that, I wish it were better for you.

I don't really know much about it.. so I don't really have an opinion on it. XD;
I just don't really like religion in general.

I love being Wiccan. <3
It's a much more fulfilling way of living than the religion I was "born with" from my grandmother. I just feel like a better person living WITH nature and life.

Ah.. The touchy subject of Wicca.. Let me put out the disclaimer that I am not bashing all of those who practice the belief, only those who abuse it and follow the parts that are most convenient for them.
I have had bad experiences with self proclaimed wiccans since I was in grade school. (They have a church near here) I have been horribly treated and disrespected by them because of their beliefs of what I am. I wont go into details unless asked, but there have been many incidents by different people who do not know each other. It is hard for me not to associate their belief with hostile people. But like many bash a religion based on it's followers, it is not the way to go. Because man is weak, and can make any good religion seem bad when selfishness is mixed in.
(My belief would probably be considered eclectic and incorporates a lot of pagan, christian, and Buddhist beliefs.)

My distaste for those who have treated me wrongly runs very deep. Those that abuse their gifts should have their abilities taken from them. They should follow all aspects of their belief; Not just the ones that are convenient to them. It will only cause harm to themselves and those who must endure their misdeeds. If they cannot respect their belief they are abusing it and should stop the practice until they have found self control and respect for the forces they manipulate.

There are too many wiccans out there that treat it like a trend, too many who don't take the religion as sacred, but skip right over to the "good stuff" and wind up misusing what they learn to fulfill their selfish desires. Just as there are many religious groups that act like hypocrites, there are many wiccans who act this way. Many who have a self righteous, holier than thou attitude. They need to be educated and taught humility. Respect all walks of life, not just the ones you like.

I have only met two wiccans (of many) who have treated me like a human being, accepted me, even respected me. He wasn't that into the belief at the time we met, but was born into it, his family members were all initiated. His mother was cautious in the beginning but opened up to me and treated me well when she figured me out. If it wasn't for her straight up, non-bs explanations to why wiccans have done what they did to me (wrongly I might add) I would hate all of it's followers, seeing them as the enemy. But those two people out of so many have changed my outlook from extreme hatred to cautious neutrality. I will see those who wrong me as misguided fools, but not those who follow it truthfully, who have not done others wrong.
I will see you for who you are, not your belief, so long as you can see me for who I am, not for what your belief tells you I am.

I'm Pagan. I'm actually not sure if i'm wiccan or pagan, really. I guess i'm still trying to discover what my path is.

@anyakan- the wiccans you've encountered have a church? i've never heard of a wiccan church, in all the years i've been into Wicca. To me, it seems like one of the reasons to be Wiccan/Pagan is to not have a church you have to go to at certain times, etc, and to be happier in the woods alone than in a building with people listening to people preach.

Originally Posted by cuddlyemokitten

No…I don’t know what you mean…Its kind of an insult if you claim to be Wiccan yourself.

I’m a true Wiccan. I was initiated at 18, which is the traditional way. And though being initiated isn’t REALLY necessary, I think it would be better. Being Wiccan is not all about casting spells, but it is a big part of being a witch. Being one with nature plays a major part. You have to respect nature, feel happy around it, feeling magick in the air.

Some of us Wiccans feel…I don’t know how to put this…Maybe sometimes uncomfortable with closed-minded religions, such as Catholicism and Christianly. Christians are usually closed minded about other religions and call them Satanist because they think only their beliefs are right. And I HAVE been a practicing Catholic. And I thought Wicca was bad, too, until I ACTUALLY read about it, and found it a lot more open than a Catholic would be. So, I chose to become Wiccan. And I am. We do not only pay attention to the Goddess, but I think it is true that the Goddess is mentioned more, like ‘Praise the Goddess, he’s here!’ or ‘Thank the Goddess that didn’t happen!’ The Goddess and God are whole, and that’s how they are viewed. It doesn’t necessarily mean we only pay attention to the Goddess.

I’ll admit, my pentacle was purchased at Spencer’s, but when you have Catholic parents who won’t buy a very nice looking one off the internet….Well, what can you do? I have two decks of tarot cards, purchased at a book store, but they were NOT five dollars. There were a lot more expensive than that. And learning about as much as you can about spells and how to do the ritual isn’t bad knowledge, though being a witch, you should learn about ALL spells, and what they are for, as well as the tools. And knowing the zodiac is a good thing…

Wicca IS about nature, and if you don’t like it…then its not for you. Goddess and God are in everything, in the trees, grass, moon, sun…Nature.

Sorry to hear that, I wish it were better for you.

What? No, I don't claim to be a Wiccan myself. When I was 13, I heard about it, looked but some information, and basically came to my own conclusions about it which resulted in a brief stint of total retardation on my part.

And I don't claim ALL Wiccans are like that, just a lot of the teenagers and people I've met. Like I said, I never met someone in real life who took Wicca seriously... whether they realized it or not, these people treated the religion like a cheap gimmick, an excuse to cast spells and live in a ridiculous fantasy land while being able to comfortably hate on the religions that may or may not have oppressed them.

That's just my experience with it. That's what I've commonly seen, and like I said, that's very negatively affected my view of it.

As for everything you've said regarding the TRUE nature of Wicca, I am well aware. I've just said what I usually see coming from Wiccans, and what I dislike about those things.

If you'd looks up and read Anyakan's post, I'm basically in the same boat as her. I know it's wrong to judge, but it's hard to forget because unfortunately, I've yet to meet a person who's done different.

i dunno what i think about wicca, since i don't know much about it.
mostly because it's just confused me... well that's like most religions.
xD;..
i just know everyone was a pegan before most religions like Christianity was created. o.o;
but err... i don't even remember my religion's name.
but basically, i believe that there is a god, but he has no real connection with the natural world.
so really, he created this for us, and we're on our own.
if that makes any sense.

Originally Posted by Liath

I'm Pagan. I'm actually not sure if i'm wiccan or pagan, really. I guess i'm still trying to discover what my path is.

@anyakan- the wiccans you've encountered have a church? i've never heard of a wiccan church, in all the years i've been into Wicca. To me, it seems like one of the reasons to be Wiccan/Pagan is to not have a church you have to go to at certain times, etc, and to be happier in the woods alone than in a building with people listening to people preach.

Google search Wiccan church. You'll also find church/schools of Wicca. The people who have started with me are not what I would call faithful followers if they are so quick to condemn and harm, they are misguided.
The church does act as a place for people to get their books, items, blessings, initiations, or place to congregate. I live in a city where you can walk in a market and find six shops that cater to pagan needs on the same street.
To me, it is kind of surprising people are saying they have never met one, when I have had so many experiences with them.

@ Anyakan
Uh…I’m not sure if you’re talking about Wiccan’s…Or even Pagans for that matter. We don’t have a church. You must be talking about some other religion…..

@ Liath
Take the time to discover it, and don’t rush it. The Goddess and God will always be there to guide you, and help you choice the path that is right for you. Give it time. ^^

@ starryblade
Paganism is one of the most oldest religions, and it is older than Christianity. But, Christianity is older than Wicca.

@ Merrow
Sorry if I misunderstood.
Anyakan’s post kind of throws me off. I’m not sure if she is talking about Wiccans, because we don’t have a church. :/ You’re second post has me a bit…skeptical. While it is true that there are other Wiccans willing to teach beginners…I wouldn’t call it a church. A church is for a priest to preach. And to be honest…we’re not here to preach. In Wicca…so long as you have belief in nature, and in the Goddess and God…well…you’re free to believe whatever you want to believe. Wiccans have different beliefs so they are not all going to be the same…

And there are cities were there are not places for Wiccans to get the things they need, and have to travel to get it. Where I live, I haven’t came across a place that is solely for Wiccans… :/

Originally Posted by cuddlyemokitten

@ Anyakan
Uh…I’m not sure if you’re talking about Wiccan’s…Or even Pagans for that matter. We don’t have a church. You must be talking about some other religion…..

@ Liath
Take the time to discover it, and don’t rush it. The Goddess and God will always be there to guide you, and help you choice the path that is right for you. Give it time. ^^

@ starryblade
Paganism is one of the most oldest religions, and it is older than Christianity. But, Christianity is older than Wicca.

@ Merrow
Sorry if I misunderstood.
Anyakan’s post kind of throws me off. I’m not sure if she is talking about Wiccans, because we don’t have a church. :/ You’re second post has me a bit…skeptical. While it is true that there are other Wiccans willing to teach beginners…I wouldn’t call it a church. A church is for a priest to preach. And to be honest…we’re not here to preach. In Wicca…so long as you have belief in nature, and in the Goddess and God…well…you’re free to believe whatever you want to believe. Wiccans have different beliefs so they are not all going to be the same…

And there are cities were there are not places for Wiccans to get the things they need, and have to travel to get it. Where I live, I haven’t came across a place that is solely for Wiccans… :/

I am very positive they are wiccan. Most likely they are independent witches, the ones starting trouble can't be that dedicated and act the way they do.
When I mentioned their "church" here, I was trying to make understood the fact that the religion is easier to access here with all of the shops and information, not to mention other followers to branch out to. You can search online if you were curious enough, but there is no doubt that they are wiccan. Beyond the fact they brag about being so. I'm in a city that is a melting pot, so there are many types of people with many beliefs. The "abnormal" is accepted, and often encouraged as a highlight of the city. (especially the closer to south street you are, the place you'll find all the shops for pagan specific interests)
What I have said still stands. It is my though on the religion and followers, my attempt to portray such thoughts in a tasteful, responsible manner that can be understood from both sides.

I don't really know much about either religions, other than that they seem to be rather peaceful and really intertwined with nature. I love nature and sorta fall into the whole 'every living thing has a soul' type of mind set. *shrugs*

Originally Posted by Anyakan

I am very positive they are wiccan. Most likely they are independent witches, the ones starting trouble can't be that dedicated and act the way they do.
When I mentioned their "church" here, I was trying to make understood the fact that the religion is easier to access here with all of the shops and information, not to mention other followers to branch out to. You can search online if you were curious enough, but there is no doubt that they are wiccan. Beyond the fact they brag about being so. I'm in a city that is a melting pot, so there are many types of people with many beliefs. The "abnormal" is accepted, and often encouraged as a highlight of the city. (especially the closer to south street you are, the place you'll find all the shops for pagan specific interests)
What I have said still stands. It is my though on the religion and followers, my attempt to portray such thoughts in a tasteful, responsible manner that can be understood from both sides.

I wouldn't call them Wiccan if they brag about it....
They might claim to be, but aren't TRUE Wiccans. *Shrug*
I've looked it up, and though Wiki sometimes isn't all that true...It still gives me little information on what this 'Wiccan church' is.

As I have said in my first post. To me, they are not faithful idealistic perfect wiccans following their faith to the T. Otherwise I would not have had such unpleasant experiences with them. There are many of them that act that way though. The focus should not still linger on the fact they have a so called church here. That has not been the basis of my opinion and does not sway it in any way. The faith is more known here because there are locations here that encourage and provide information and supplies that support that faith. Church is a community of people, not so much a physical building, even though they have a building in town, I am not sure what it is used for. It has nothing to do what I have been saying. Moving on.

I have only found two who were ever humble in my presence. One knew less about his faith than I did, yet was still humble. As with any religion there are many people who associate themselves with a belief, but there is a difference between those who claim they are something and those who practice what they preach.
I find the majority are not practitioners, but people who do not respect the forces they manipulate, they look for reasons to cast spells, place charms on things, and even cause harm to those they find a problem with. And it must be so exciting for them to find someone who according to their faith, is painted as an enemy, a person to look down upon and do things that would cause harm to that person in order to have control over what cannot be seen.
These people get into the faith for the wrong reasons.
It is this aspect of wicca I cannot stand. I have done nothing to them, yet it has not stopped the treatment I have received. I have never been hostile until my brother was being suspected as a threat. He is young and knows nothing of their belief. I heard what the wiccan was leading on to and thoroughly (very forcefully) shut him down.
I was shaking with rage. My brother should not have to endure what I went through. No human should be treated that way!
I don't know any other group who acts so aggressively against people who have nothing to do with them.
I have already stated before though. I condemn those brazen enough to mistreat others. I am open minded enough to say that not all wiccans are like this. I have found two who didn't end up being very ugly on the inside, a sad statistic, but two kind people is better than none. You can say that all of the hostile ones are not wiccan, and only a handful are actually wiccan in your opinion, but that is not practical. Same with saying all people who claim to be christian are not, for their lack of piety or attendance in mass.
And if I must say it again, yes, they are wiccan, not pagan, not neo-druid.
I don't object to the faith, just the aggressive followers.. and maybe the disposition against certain types of people.

Originally Posted by cuddlyemokitten

@ EpoxyObsession
Well, we all have our own beliefs, and its fine if you don't believe in magick or gods. For us, the God and Goddess play a huge role in our lives. We always look to them for guidance, as I'm sure that many other people look to their own god for that as well.

Its fine that you don't believe in it, so long as you know we're not evil and trying to make things evil. I, personally, don't believe in abortion, but I will not go to a clinic and bomb it because of it. It is the woman's choice whether she wants to have that child or not, even if she is killing another life.

I wanted to believe in gods and magick, but there just wasn't enough evidence for me to sustain it.

I tried so many spells and so many rituals (both of my own making and from books), and they just never did anything even when I believed with all my might. I used candles, herbs, oils, fire, water, and plenty of other things. I really wanted them to work. But they just didn't, same as every other religion.

The only thing that ever even sort of worked for me was goddess guidance card decks, where I shuffled the cards and laid them out according to some rule, and then interpreted them based on the goddess on the card. I think it was mostly just the vagueness of the cards that allowed me to find meaning in them.

I once had a friend who was Wiccan who would go on one-sided tirades how religious people treated other religions so horribly and that all religions corrupted people's minds and made them horribly violent, except for her religion. She said anyone who was a real Wiccan was kind.

It kind of put a skewed perception for me on Wiccans, though I know her anger was mostly out of her own contempt in her mind instead of what her religion was teaching.

Although, I think everyone can be like that. It takes all kinds, right?

I don't know anything about wiccanism (?), it just has no appeal to me. :/

Honestly, I'm far more interested in Buddhism, Taoism and Christianity than any of these bizarre polytheist religions. The appeal of the ones I like have always been the personal path to God and the path to enlightenment. To pray, truly pray has always intrigued me. To be aware of it, and the praising of God for all that's good, I mean, how awesome is that? Do Wiccan pray in praise or in questioning or asking for stuff like some stupid christians do?

Can you actually have a personal relationship with God when there are more than one?

Originally Posted by cuddlyemokitten

Paganism was formed BEFORE Christianity. How, may I ask, is it for people with 'pre-christian' beliefs?

While it is true that Wicca is under the umbrella of Paganism, Paganism was around longer than Christianity. I was not implying that Wicca and Paganism are exactly the same thing, because they are not. But they do have the same beliefs, as in respecting and honoring nature. They are both nature based. Don't make me rant, though, please...If I do, I'll say things I don't want to...Mostly to Christians, or more so, Catholics...Very closed minded Catholics. >.<

@ Tut'ankhamun
Well, if he's not creating a problem for you, then great. ^^

Your dad will not like me, then. xD I'm Wiccan and gay...And I want a tattoo! xDD

@ Nada Kyo
Nope. Its not bad at all. Look into it or ask me questions. ^^

@ slickie
Really? That's great! I'm happy something like that helped you to sleep, especially coming from...Was it a book for Pagans, or Wiccans? I'm assuming Wiccans, yes?

Well, I try not to talk to my dad about stuff like that anymore because I'm tired of him ragging on my friends' lifestyles.

He might like you if he didn't know you were Wiccan or gay.

I personally have no problem with male homosexuals.

Well, looking at these horror stories, I'm glad the only Wiccan I've come across is Dev.. o.o;

I've researched the religion and have a pretty good understanding of it. The worst part is trying to teach others that it's not the "evil" that they believe it to be. Mostly cause they don't give a damn. And another irking thing is to see it on the media, done completely wrong. Ugh.

I think it's a very beautiful religion that brings people together on more than a physical or material form. The spiritual aspect is very refreshing.

I think it's kind of a bizarre religion, but I guess I would, being a Lutheran and all.

Wiccan/Paganism is actually one of the religions I like. I'm Christian, and always thought they were weird...Until I befriended one, and realized how off my picture of them was.

It's a pretty down to earth (no pun intended) religion, and is very interesting. I even dabbled in it, but It just isn't for me, no matter how interesting it is. My Christianity is too strong to let me stray from it.

But yeah. My neighbor has some pretty messed up thoughts about what Wiccans believe in, and I've tried telling her that no, they don't worship the devil, but she doesn't believe me, and claims she knows better than I do...

She's really stupid :/

I have a bit of respect for Wicca, being the idealogically benign religion that it is. I like that it's accepting of pretty much everyone, and doesn't hate on other religions so much. I've been trying to learn more about it, but it's hard in a conservative Christian household. :/

As far as I know I haven't met any Wiccans, but I have a friend I see at a LOT of conventions who says she's Pagan (don't know speifics), and she is one of the nicest people I've even met.

What I don't like is people who just take the steriotypes or whatever they've been told ('specially by their religion ¬_¬) and decide that it's the truth and can never be wrong and it applies to all in the category. Like one teacher I heard say that Wiccans are evil and worship Satan. >:|

I'm a student of Wicca at the moment, studying and learning about the religion before assuming it as "my religion". What I like best about Wicca, and Paganism in general, is how personlized it can be. It focuses around a core idea, but it leaves room for you to have your own beliefs. Personally, I believe in spirits and ghosts and energy. Most of the Wiccan practices coincide with my own. A lot of the new things I am learning about is the God and the Goddess, and all the misconceptions people have about this religion. Also, I am learning how to affect my own energy, but I dare not dabble in magic too deeply, since I still know so little. And I think that should go for anyone wanting to pick up Wicca. Do not enter into it lightly and actually learn and study it before you try using magic, or you could end up hurting yourself. Any religion, really, should be carefully studied before practicing or deciding to go with it. Otherwise you will feel such a fool if someone asks you to explain what your religion is about and you can't even answer them because you don't know. Which is why when people ask, I tell them I am studying it.

@Cricket: I agree entirely with the study before you buy suggestion - I hate being caught on explaining what I believe because I don't understand it myself. Also, I couldn't really say I believe in something if I don't even know what it is I believe in. XD Part of this, of course, is researching not only about the religion itself, but also the sources you're using for study - if the guy who wrote your book isn't a credible scholar of the faith you're studying, everything you learn could be complete bunko. Which stinks. =3

As to the topic in general, I suppose it depends on the Wiccan/Pagan in question. I'm not a fan of those who don't really know what they're doing - fluff bunnies who claim the title of Wiccan without actually having a clue what it is, for example - but that goes for every faith, and not just the Pagan/Wiccan set.

I am friends with a number of pagans from different faiths. Most of them are reconstructionists, which makes them really fun to discuss religion with. They literally bring ancient mythology to life. They're a lot of fun. =3